published Tuesday, May 21st, 2013

Busted!

about Clay Bennett...

The son of a career army officer, Bennett led a nomadic life, attending ten different schools before graduating in 1980 from the University of North Alabama with degrees in Art and History. After brief stints as a staff artist at the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette and the Fayetteville (NC) Times, he went on to serve as the editorial cartoonist for the St. Petersburg Times (1981-1994) and The Christian Science Monitor (1997-2007), before joining the staff of the ...

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acerigger said...

BTW, for what it's worth, Republicans in Congress have known that the Internal Revenue Service (IRS) asked additional questions of some tea party groups seeking tax exempt status since last July, only recently raising the issue as a matter of controversy according to documents released by the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform.

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/05/20/revealed-republicans-knew-about-irs-investigations-of-tea-party-groups-last-july/

May 21, 2013 at 12:25 a.m.
alprova said...

The Tea-Party crowd is becoming more and more irrelevant, and the more that they push this silly IRS scandal down the road, the more people will turn their nose up at them.

Tea-Party officials right and left are coming out of the woodwork and claiming to have been hassled by not only by the IRS, but the FBI as well.

It makes good news stories for Fox News, but I'll be waiting to see if any of these people take oaths on the stand in a court of law and continue to tell their tall tales.

By the time this is all over, there will not be a Tea-Party to even worry about.

Republicans -- save yourselves. The time to distance yourself from these crazy people is now!!

May 21, 2013 at 12:25 a.m.
AndrewLohr said...

Sean Hannity says President Obama met with an IRS leader the day before the hassling of tea party groups started. Will the most transparent administration in history put the President and the IRS person, and any witnesses, on the stand under oath to tell what went on at that meeting? What can be private about a meeting between the CEO of our country and one of his administrators?

Spending 1100 days waiting for the IRS to make up its mind is "tall tales"? Being asked how your pray is "tall tales"? (Doesn't the Constitution forbid religious tests?)

The Tea Party distances itself from people who think deficits don't matter, that sustainability doesn't matter, that Social Security and Medicare being broke doesn't matter.

May 21, 2013 at 12:36 a.m.
alprova said...

AndreLohr wrote: "Sean Hannity says President Obama met with an IRS leader the day before the hassling of tea party groups started."

If Sean Hannity said that, then he is guilty of passing on a falsehood.

The rumor is that the day before the alleged IRS scrutiny of Tea-Party affiliated groups began, the President had a meeting with Colleen Kelley, who is the President of the National Treasury Employees Union.

According to the Inspector General report, It was on the next day that "The new Acting Manager, Technical Unit, suggested the need for a Sensitive Case Report on the Tea Party cases. The Determinations Unit Program Manager Agreed."

"Will the most transparent administration in history put the President and the IRS person, and any witnesses, on the stand under oath to tell what went on at that meeting?"

Probably not.

"What can be private about a meeting between the CEO of our country and one of his administrators?"

Probably everything.

"Spending 1100 days waiting for the IRS to make up its mind is "tall tales"?"

The tall tales are that the FBI harassed these Tea-Party group officials that are making such claims.

"Being asked how your pray is "tall tales"? (Doesn't the Constitution forbid religious tests?)"

Has anyone actually provided a copy of the intrusive questionnaires to prove these assertions? I'm not saying that anyone is lying, but I would love to see proof that written questions such as the above indeed exist.

"The Tea Party distances itself from people who think deficits don't matter, that sustainability doesn't matter, that Social Security and Medicare being broke doesn't matter."

The Tea-Party needs to go it alone, rather than to attempt to take over the Republican Party. Then the nation would get a clue just how irrelevant they truly are.

May 21, 2013 at 1:27 a.m.
alprova said...

Forms and Questionnaires sent by the IRS to Tea-Party groups. Where are all those "weird" questions?

IRS Form 1024;

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f1024.pdf

Follow-up questionnaire sent to one group;

http://www.scribd.com/doc/141237953/San-Fernando-Valley-Ltr-From-IRS

Follow-up questionnaire to a second group;

http://www.scribd.com/doc/141753838/IRS-Request-for-More-Information-Progress-Texas-Feb-2012

I can find no proof whatsoever that the IRS asked anyone "How will you pray?" on an official letter for follow-up information.

I'm wide open to any proof that there was such a question sent in printed form to any right-wing entity that has made such allegations.

Anyone?

May 21, 2013 at 1:57 a.m.
AndrewLohr said...

AL version of NR version of IRS excuses: We didn't target people who say big government is unmanageable for saying big government is unmanageable. We targeted them because big government is unmanageable.

Alpo, Did you read the questionnaires you posted links to? They include questions such as, You seem to be connected with XYZ Patriot group: tell us all about them, including their federal employer identification number. List your directors and where they work. Provide copies of all materials you've distributed or posted. (I tried to copy from one to paste here, but it wasn't friendly.)

Jesus hung out with tax collectors. And prostitutes. Some of them repented.

May 21, 2013 at 2:54 a.m.
AndrewLohr said...

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/irs-conservative-group-2009-members-pray-193833144.html More precisely, IRS asked a prolife group how its prayers outside an abortuary were educational.

May 21, 2013 at 3:04 a.m.
AndrewLohr said...

http://www.timesfreepress.com/news/20... The IRS's own inspector general found some of the questions the IRS asked the Chattanooga Tea Party inappropriate. The IRS spent 18 months over the application and demanded a reply in three weeks.

May 21, 2013 at 3:10 a.m.
fairmon said...

Congress gives the departments significant authority and latitude including spending. They then act surprised that people will be people with some being mavericks that over reach their authority and many that over spend, over hire and over pay. They seem to be surprised that some are flat incompetent for their position just as congress has a high percent that are not competent for their elected position with no qualifications other than citizenship and age.

I seriously doubt any criminal charges will come out of any of the four issues in the headlines since incompetence and responding to encouragement to behave in a certain manner is not a crime. The American voters short attention span and lack of memory will assure there is no affect on the 2016 elections, sorry about that republicans, you are wasting your time. But, keep it up since the economy seems to be improving more without government interference than when you are attempting to manipulate the free markets.

May 21, 2013 at 4:54 a.m.
hambone said...

Don't you just love it when someone starts a post with " Sean Hannity says............." !

May 21, 2013 at 5:28 a.m.
anniebelle said...

Indeed, my BS detector goes off the charts.

May 21, 2013 at 6:18 a.m.
fairmon said...

The IRS could be drastically reduced with common sense tax code changes. What qualifies any political group to be tax exempt? Why are churches totally tax exempt? Congress provides revenue exception upon exception then wants to spend more. The same favor showing is happening with the AHCA with exemptions then more exemptions.

Over 1 trillion for U.S. investment or paying dividend dollars to Americans are held by companies in foreign accounts because congress and the president insist on them paying 35% taxes although they paid taxes in the country where the money was earned. Some have sold bonds at less than 3% interest in order to have U.S. dollars to spend on their business instead of repatriating the dollars and paying 35% taxes. How smart is that of congress? Altria is one example with a 35.4% effective tax rate last year. Others, favored by congress pay much less with some being zero although profitable, why? Why not abolish all the loop holes and set an internationally competitive rate. Congress knows the American consumer is too gullible to realize that business taxes are included in the cost of the goods or services purchased, it is a hidden tax, the fools tax as some privately call it. The high rates also gives congress more room or ability to manipulate and show favor to some businesses.

May 21, 2013 at 6:49 a.m.
degage said...

As I watch the destruction of Oklahoma from tornados, I think all this other stuff should not be what we are talking about, but what is happening to those impacted by this and what we can do to help. I will contribute what I can, how about you?

May 21, 2013 at 7:48 a.m.
joepulitzer said...

alprova, hambone and anniebelle: Bennett should draw these three in the same bed. Of course he would also have to draw tree limbs protruding out from under the sheets -- Their dream Ménage à trois.

May 21, 2013 at 7:56 a.m.
klifnotes said...

From our own local news, wrcbtv/tfp:Did Tea Pary whiners purposely stretch the truth or out and right lied?:

"WASHINGTON — A former top Internal Revenue Service official said Monday that U.S. Rep. Paul Ryan stretched the truth when the former vice presidential candidate mentioned a Chattanooga nonprofit to bolster the idea the IRS favors liberal groups over conservative groups.

"The IRS was doing this because they were concerned about political activities by nonprofits. That's the debate that seems to be taking place here," Ryan told former acting IRS commissioner Steven Miller. "Some of these that were approved were Chattanooga Organized for Action ... and the Progressive USA. If you were concerned about political activity, did you have targeting lists that contained words like 'progressive' or 'organizing' in their names?"

At a House hearing last week, Ryan cited Chattanooga Organized for Action as an example of a left-leaning nonprofit that was cleared for tax-exempt status faster than tea party organizations targeted and delayed because of their conservative ideology.

>"Left unsaid by Ryan: Chattanooga Organized for Action experienced a lengthy IRS review itself. Additionally, its leaders sought a completely different tax designation than the Chattanooga Tea Party and other groups caught up in the scandal."

May 21, 2013 at 7:57 a.m.
PlainTruth said...

Setting aside the thrashing the Tea Party helped inflict on the Dems in the mid-terms, I really don't get the ire they raise from the left.

May 21, 2013 at 8:12 a.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

I tell you, we should all be very concerned about IRS and ATF and FBI and EPA and USDA... overreach and lack of respect for privacy.

I don't even see anyone complaining about the government, through the IRS, taking peoples health records. I guess that is because progressives have been telling us for years that centralised health records are the key to reducing health care costs. Are we really buying all of this? Has human nature suddenly changed in the last 100 years such that it is safe to centralise this all of this power and not expect a bad result? I think not.

We need to turn this around before we see a political crisis of epic proportions.

May 21, 2013 at 8:27 a.m.
PlainTruth said...

BRP: To the duped, however, the centralized power is sacrosanct.

May 21, 2013 at 8:36 a.m.
Leaf said...

I don't think human nature has changed much in 100 years, but human culture and technology certainly has. It makes centralizing power easier and more efficient. Perhaps that's not better.

Perhaps we should decentralize the power. (You know, replace the fossil plants with solar power.)

May 21, 2013 at 8:55 a.m.
PlainTruth said...

Many thought that President Obama would usher in a new era of higher standards in Washington. They were wrong. No?

May 21, 2013 at 9 a.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

Leaf said... "I don't think human nature has changed much in 100 years, but human culture and technology certainly has. It makes centralizing power easier and more efficient. Perhaps that's not better."

Technology for sure. Culture, I am not so sure. I look at the army of "zombies" in every public square staring into their "smart" phones and wonder...

We have been told that bigger and bigger companies and banks and government are necessary to compete in the world economy. It is very easy for all of these big, unaccountable and to-big-to-fail organisations to collude with each other. Who's interests come first in this arrangement, the power brokers in the organisations or the population at large? I think you know the answer.

It would probably be better if we demanded the break-up of the big banks, decentralisation of government control and enforcement of antitrust laws. Maybe this would slow down the pace of technical innovation, but I am not so sure that is a bad thing. It seems to me that technological change is coming at us so fast that we don't have time to consider if we like the direction it is taking us in.

May 21, 2013 at 9:18 a.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Good one, Clay Bennett. You know political corruption has really gone amuck when your politicians actually believe their own lies, feel they’re entitled to illegal campaign slush funds, and demand that crooks be unhampered by the law of the land.

The 501(c)(4)s section of the Internal Revenue Code entitles “social welfare” organizations an exemption from Federal taxation. The organizations receiving the exemption are prohibited from supporting campaigns of political candidates.

It’s the responsibility of the IRS to award 501c (4) designations to “social welfare” organizations. It’s also the responsibility of the IRS to confirm that the organizations applying for the “social welfare” exemption are what they claim to be, and to make sure the organizations receiving a 501(c)(4) “exemptions comply with the law.

May 21, 2013 at 9:20 a.m.
PlainTruth said...

So Laurel. You're approving of the IRS's dealings with conservative movements? Really?

May 21, 2013 at 9:23 a.m.
alprova said...

Andrew, I read your link from top to bottom. I did not find the questions over-the-top at all.

Yes...the IRS most definitely was thorough in their scrutiny, to determine the level of education that the organization was poised to provide in order to qualify for tax-exempt status.

I don't see what was asked as unusual or in any manner targeting them unjustly.

I too question prayer outside a facility that performs abortion as educational in intent.

Was the agent(s) involved guilty of any personal bias? Perhaps.

But, their application was ultimately approved.

May 21, 2013 at 9:36 a.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

mountainlaurel said... "You know political corruption has really gone amuck when your politicians actually believe their own lies, feel they’re entitled to illegal campaign slush funds, and demand that crooks be unhampered by the law of the land."

You can count on political corruption going amuck when you centralise power so much that the politicians not longer feel accountable to the citizens. We are LONG past that stage. Please consider that this problem is deeply rooted on both sides of the aisle.

May 21, 2013 at 9:37 a.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

alprova said... "But, their application was ultimately approved."

Probably about the time that they could see that the problem was going public and they could not be caught holding the bag. You are too eager to excuse your government. It is pretty safe to say that you would be all up in arms if the players were different.

The end justifies the means, right? As long as you like the end?

May 21, 2013 at 9:41 a.m.
alprova said...

Progressive groups were targeted with extra scrutiny as well. Proof to that effect is coming to light.

All that is likely going to come from this is an overhaul of IRS regulations streamlining the tax-exempt application process to be a bit more friendly and to set forth some more reasonable timelines for approval or denial of applications.

I predict that any lawsuits that emerge out of this will be thrown out of court.

May 21, 2013 at 9:43 a.m.
mountainlaurel said...

PlainTruth asks: "So Laurel. You're approving of the IRS's dealings with conservative movements?" Really?

What do you mean, PT. Are suggesting that we need to establish some kind official affirmation action law when it comes to investigating potential criminal activity? I could go for this.

May 21, 2013 at 9:45 a.m.
Leaf said...

Here's what I like about you, BigRidge. Even though we don't share the exact same politics (And therefore you are obviously the antichrist), you are mostly consistent.

You don't have an unreasonable hatred for everything government related and an unreasonable love for giant corporations. A healthy distrust of all those who would wield power is a good thing.

May 21, 2013 at 9:46 a.m.
alprova said...

Right now, a great many accusations are flying. Most of them are not bearing very many facts and provable truths.

Tea-Party activists are anti-tax protesters by virtue of their political platform(s). Of course they deserved more scrutiny.

The more I read on all this, the more I laugh at the outrage being offered.

I'm sure that in time, most of the rest of America will be laughing as well.

May 21, 2013 at 9:48 a.m.
Leaf said...

People seem to be assuming that it was a problem that the IRS hassled these organizations. I say, as long as they are hassling them equally it's a great thing! It's a huge travesty of justice that these terrible political money laundering organizations can exist and disguise themselves as non-profits.

If our politicians were honest, they would outlaw these organizations altogether. It seems to me that this might be a case of mid-level people in the IRS trying to do the right thing despite all the money people pushing them to be dishonest.

IF the right-wing ones were being hassled more, well, there might be a benign explanation. There are more of them, since they were invented by Carl Rove and funded by all those Republican billionaires.

May 21, 2013 at 9:55 a.m.
caddy said...

My B.S detector goes off when I hear, "Don't look for Tyranny around every corner,"

Especially when you see Clear examples of tyranny at the highest level at every corner. Sheeple truly are a dumb lot.

May 21, 2013 at 9:56 a.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

klifnotes said...

From our own local news, wrcbtv/tfp:Did Tea Pary whiners purposely stretch the truth or out and right lied?:


From the article:

“Records provided by Lance show the IRS took nearly two years before deeming Chattanooga Organized for Action tax-exempt under the 501(c)(3) classification. It took about three years for the Chattanooga Tea Party to get the same treatment under the 501(c)(4) designation.”


Since the rules for the 501(c)(3) are much more restrictive, concerning political activity, than the 501(c)(4) designation you would expect the COA organization to require more scrutiny. However they were approved quicker so just maybe the truth was stretched or lies told but not by the ones you feel are the guilty party.

May 21, 2013 at 2:40 p.m.
Maximus said...

A great idea.....The IRS playing a key role in YOUR healthcare decisions. Abolish Obamacare NOW!

May 21, 2013 at 3:02 p.m.
Maximus said...

Alprova says..."progressive groups were targeted with equal scrutiny as well". Like I said one of the mindless, drone, passionate supporters of the socialist utopia welfare Democrat Party. I'm sure George Soros and Matt Damon were targeted....uuuuuu, huuuuu.

May 21, 2013 at 3:07 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

Leaf said ...

Jtwhatever. Correct. I would like to see a lot of money leave politics - especially the secret money.


Do you feel that it would be appropriate for you or I to pay for an ad in the paper, on the T.V., internet, etc. that spells out our political views or even endorses a candidate for office? What if we didn’t have enough money to cover the ad could we ask a friend, neighbor, or ally to help pay for the ad. How many friends would be too many? To keep ourselves safe from the reprisals of our political opponents would it be wise that as with voting we could keep our personal names and any contributions both monetary and nonmonetary private? Couldn’t we just be identified by a group title?

Wouldn’t you feel that our right to freedom of expression allows this?

I know that all freedoms are not absolute but the outright banning of the activity and not just reasonable regulation hardly seems to be legal.

May 21, 2013 at 3:33 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

The union representing the State Department's security officers has endorsed House Republicans' call for a special panel to investigate the Obama administration's handling of Benghazi.

J. Adler, the national president of the Federal Law Enforcement Officers Association, wrote to Rep. Frank Wolf (R-Va.) on Friday to call for a “bipartisan” select committee to be formed “immediately.” The union represents 26,000 federal officers, including those working for the State Department's Bureau of Diplomatic Security.

“The production of 1,000 documents by the State Department and the administration, as well as the testimony of former Secretary [of State Hillary] Clinton, has proven insufficient in addressing numerous unanswered questions,” Adler wrote. “When the questions involve the fatalities of two heroic SEALS, as well as the injuries of brave DSS Special Agents, every government resource should be committed towards answering them.

“We don't kick heroes under the carpet because we find an investigative inquiry administratively inconvenient.”

http://thehill.com/blogs/global-affairs/terrorism/300411-state-department-union-endorses-benghazi-select-committee#ixzz2TcS3xl1y

May 21, 2013 at 3:45 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Leaf says: “It's a huge travesty of justice that these terrible political money laundering organizations can exist and disguise themselves as non-profits. If our politicians were honest, they would outlaw these organizations altogether. It seems to me that this might be a case of mid-level people in the IRS trying to do the right thing despite all the money people pushing them to be dishonest.”

Yes, I believe the real culprit in this situation is the tax law written by the U.S. Congress, which is giving these political groups tax exempt status under 501 (c) 4. Indeed, I’d like to see the U.S. Congress explain to us specifically how groups like Roves Crossroads or Priorities USA or these Tea Party groups like the Chattanooga Tea Party are promoting “social welfare” issues?

May 21, 2013 at 4:16 p.m.
miraweb said...

Speaking of special scrutiny. I am a bit puzzled about the TFP nuking my comments. Every source was cited with the original content. The link to Amazon was not a spam link or a promotion but satire that if you followed you might have seen went to a hand mirror reflecting (for the humor impaired) the general lack of self-awareness of the individual to whom it was directed.

My apologies if I personally offended anyone at the TFP or on the forum.

Cheers!

May 21, 2013 at 5:06 p.m.
PlainTruth said...

whole lotta nukin goin on

May 21, 2013 at 5:22 p.m.
chatt_man said...

Ahh Yes... let us all celebrate the most transparent administration the people have ever seen.

http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-pn-top-irs-official-fifth-amendment-20130521,0,6645565.story

May 21, 2013 at 5:30 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

I think the TFP web site had a stroke or a strike.

Sometimes it shows 44 posts then 92 posts then 44 posts then 88 posts then jzxjcjkurshweiu978eewuowqjend

May 21, 2013 at 5:50 p.m.
limric said...

It certainly seems the censors at the TFP did not like the content or direction of the commentary. Perhaps pre-empting another evening of inflammatory one upsmanship. Maybe you're right JT6 as there doesn't seem to be a specific pattern.

??? Oh well.

May 21, 2013 at 5:50 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

Sometimes if you catch it just right you can see all of your posts that appear to be missing in your personal comment page.

May 21, 2013 at 5:55 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

Man this sure does sound strange and it is unconfirmed. Maybe the conspiracy theorists here than have guessed at many reasons for Stevens being in Benghazi will be able to do something with it.

by Roger L Simon

More whistleblowers will emerge shortly in the escalating Benghazi scandal, according to two former U.S. diplomats who spoke with PJ Media Monday afternoon.

According to the diplomats, what these whistleblowers will say will be at least as explosive as what we have already learned about the scandal, including details about what really transpired in Benghazi that are potentially devastating to both Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton.

The former diplomats inform PJM the new revelations concentrate in two areas — what Ambassador Chris Stevens was actually doing in Benghazi and the pressure put on General Carter Ham, then in command of U.S. Africa Command (AFRICOM) and therefore responsible for Libya, not to act to protect jeopardized U.S. personnel.

Stevens’ mission in Benghazi, they will say, was to buy back Stinger missiles from al-Qaeda groups issued to them by the State Department, not by the CIA. Such a mission would usually be a CIA effort, but the intelligence agency had opposed the idea because of the high risk involved in arming “insurgents” with powerful weapons that endanger civilian aircraft.

Hillary Clinton still wanted to proceed because, in part, as one of the diplomats said, she wanted “to overthrow Gaddafi on the cheap.” This left Stevens in the position of having to clean up the scandalous enterprise when it became clear that the “insurgents” actually were al-Qaeda – indeed, in the view of one of the diplomats, the same group that attacked the consulate and ended up killing Stevens.

The former diplomat who spoke with PJ Media regarded the whole enterprise as totally amateurish and likened it to the Mike Nichols film Charlie Wilson’s War about a clueless congressman who supplies Stingers to the Afghan guerrillas. “It’s as if Hillary and the others just watched that movie and said ‘Hey, let’s do that!’” the diplomat said.

He added that he and his colleagues think the leaking of General David Petraeus’ affair with his biographer Paula Broadwell was timed to silence the former CIA chief on these matters.

Regarding General Ham, military contacts of the diplomats tell them that AFRICOM had Special Ops “assets in place that could have come to the aid of the Benghazi consulate immediately (not in six hours).”

Ham was told by the White House not to send the aid to the trapped men, but Ham decided to disobey and did so anyway, whereupon the White House “called his deputy and had the deputy threaten to relieve Ham of his command.”

The White House motivation in all this is as yet unclear, but it is known that Ham retired quietly in April 2013 as head of AFRICOM.

May 21, 2013 at 6:17 p.m.
LibDem said...

Jt6gR3hM, it seems to be a technical malfunction. Jeez, the only day I've made a post that wasn't dumb and it's gone.

May 21, 2013 at 6:18 p.m.
miraweb said...

I kind of hope it was a lightning strike (quite possible today) rather than editorial benihana. As often as forums like these drift to the lowest common denominator (Hi Francis!), I would have a lot less respect for the TFP if they were editing out issues that cut to close to the bone.

May 21, 2013 at 6:18 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Jt6gR3hm says: "To keep ourselves safe from the reprisals of our political opponents would it be wise that as with voting we could keep our personal names and any contributions both monetary and nonmonetary private? Couldn’t we just be identified by a group title?"

As a citizen, I believe we need to know who is contributing money to our elections. If a group of gangsters are contributing big money to a particular candidate, I certainly want to know about it, and I’m very concerned that these various political organizations are exploiting this 501 (c) 4 "social welfare" status crap so they do not have to disclose their donors.

May 21, 2013 at 6:24 p.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

It is really great when your public servants claim the 5th so they don't have to tell what they have been doing to you.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2328696/Lois-Lerner-Top-IRS-official-invoke-Fifth-Amendment-congressional-hearing-tea-party-targeting-program.html

Right?

May 21, 2013 at 6:27 p.m.
miraweb said...

And one man's "political reprisal" is another's "accountability."

We already require all political donations be identified and be subject to certain monetary limits. Hence all the fancy footwork to hide the bulk of the money flowing in to buy votes in Congress.

Unfortunately, the fox (and the FOX) are guarding the henhouse.

May 21, 2013 at 6:29 p.m.
miraweb said...

She is as entitled to her 5th Amendment rights as other folks are to their 2nd. Constitution is funny that way. Frankly, I'm sure the committee chairs are thrilled. After losing all their coverage to a national emergency, they will be beating the drum twice as loudly. A reluctant witness? Pure gold.

May 21, 2013 at 6:30 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

mountainlaurel said...

As a citizen, I believe we need to know who is contributing money to our elections. If a gangster is contributing big money to a candidate, I certainly want to know about it, and I’m very concerned about the fact that this 501 (c) 4 status does not require disclosure of an organization’s donors.


You can’t give big money directly to candidates. Individuals can give $2600 and PAC’s $5000.

With so much of our personal information readily available on the internet we are all subject to being threatened with it to alter our political activity. The moment that the names of donors are leaked or released opposition research begins. Once they have something on you they threaten you to withdraw support from their opponents or they release it as a warning to others. It has happened many times and is very effective in shutting down people’s right to political participation. Its the same reason that voting is done in private.

On a smaller level we saw this scenario play out here a few days ago.

May 21, 2013 at 6:42 p.m.
miraweb said...

Voting is a private act (though your voter registration is a public document, really). Influence peddling deserves all the transparency and daylight that can be mustered.

It is true that some folks' private interests take a hit when their customers learn what they really care about by who (or what) they back.

So what?

Walmart is currently taking a hit because they withdrew from the Bangladesh working conditions consortium for fear of "union cooties."

I may well make shopping choices based on that information. Nothing wrong with that. Walmart has stated their position by their action. I am free to state mine with my wallet.

Choices in the political arena can (and should) have real world consequences.

May 21, 2013 at 6:49 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

miraweb said...

And one man's "political reprisal" is another's "accountability."

(You really do think that launching personal reprisals on you political opponents is the same as making them accountable. It is that type of thinking that has produced most of the political scandals and crimes in this country. You’re all for hard ball until your opponents bring the heat and then it is all “this is so Un-American and un-Constitutional”)

We already require all political donations be identified and be subject to certain monetary limits.

(So why are you so concerned about donations being made to candidates as they are ready controled in the manner you wish?)

Hence all the fancy footwork to hide the bulk of the money flowing in to buy votes in Congress.

(No more so that the fancy footwork to hide the fact of who we vote for)

Unfortunately, the fox (and the FOX) are guarding the henhouse.

(Every time you left wingers obsess over Fox News it is verification that they are doing their job to keep the left honest)

May 21, 2013 at 6:57 p.m.
miraweb said...

Obsess over FOX? No.

Laugh? Often.

Frankly, Fox was a major reason Romney lost the election. When the moderates and independents become convinced your party is a more than a little nuts - winning elections gets really, really hard.

Thanks, FOX! We love ya!

May 21, 2013 at 7:02 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

miraweb said...

Choices in the political arena can (and should) have real world consequences.


“The politics of Personal Destruction” it has such a nice ring to it ... don’t you think so?

I guess we will have to agree to disagree as I take a more individual liberty tact and you the more collectivist authoritarian approach. Just remember this the next time some conservative group uses what you consider to be slimy tactics to puts the screws to someone or group you support just to make them “accountable”.

May 21, 2013 at 7:07 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

miraweb said...

Frankly, Fox was a major reason Romney lost the election. When the moderates and independents become convinced your party is a more than a little nuts - winning elections gets really, really hard.


Care to flesh out that bit of thinly defined rhetoric. I haven't read any serious critiques that present the election in that light. If you can provide a cogent presentation you may be onto a new line of electoral research.

May 21, 2013 at 7:14 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

miraweb if I were a Liberal and you were a Conservative I would be justified, at lease in P.C. liberal circles, in calling you a Nazi for such political positions. However I'm not and you are not so I can't.

Lucky for you ...Right?

May 21, 2013 at 7:21 p.m.
miraweb said...

Really? Pulling a full passive-aggressive Godwin?

yawn.

Two things brought down Romney (three, if you count his unfortunate mouth) - the base was too small and the independents leaning right too few.

Fox posted the worst numbers its had in years on trust and independents really couldn't take just one more "Sarah Palin" or "Ann Coulter" crazy fest.

So - please - FOX - don't change a single thing.

We love you just the way you are.

.

http://www.publicpolicypolling.com/main/2013/02/fox-news-credibility-declines.html

May 21, 2013 at 7:27 p.m.
miraweb said...

Not worried about the right listening to me. Not even that worried about the right listening to this guy:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8kwxlHf0cE

May 21, 2013 at 7:36 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

miraweb said...

She is as entitled to her 5th Amendment rights as other folks are to their 2nd. Constitution is funny that way.


Wait a minute miraweb seems to have some concern for what’s Constitutional although she does have a decidedly non-concern about the 1st. I guess its just a situational thing.

May 21, 2013 at 7:38 p.m.
dude_abides said...

miraweb coined... "editorial benihana" LMAO

May 21, 2013 at 7:47 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

miraweb said...

Fox posted the worst numbers its had in years on trust and independents really couldn't take just one more "Sarah Palin" or "Ann Coulter" crazy fest.

So - please - FOX - don't change a single thing.

We love you just the way you are.


So Fox posted the worst numbers its had in years but you failed to put it in the context of how this compared to the other cable news networks.

It appears to me that for years when the weekly ratings are released of the top ten shows Fox typically has the top five by a wide margin.

There was a headline a few days ago about MSNBC's ratings were getting so low that they could become immeasurable.

May 21, 2013 at 7:49 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

Why is the White House lying about something so mundane as when they found out about the I.G.’s report on the IRS?

Friday, May 10: IRS official Lois Lerner intentional leaks the results of the report and apologizes for it occurring. That this was done on Friday has no significance.

Jay Carney says he “knows nothing” about who knew what when.

Treasury Secretary Jack Lew says he just now heard about it on the news

Monday, May 13: Obama says he also “knew nothing” till he caught it on Fox News on Friday.

Jay Carney says White House counsel Kathy Ruemmler was told of the report the week of April 22

Tuesday, May 14: The I.G’s report is officially released

Wednesday, May 15: Acting IRS Commissioner Steven Miller resigns

Thursday, May 16: Obama again says that he “knows nothing” except what those liars on Fox News said on Friday.

Friday, May 17: Treasury Secretary Jack Lew says ... well he didn’t really find out about the report from the news but was informed of it in March but quickly added that he didn’t really know what it was all about until May 10.

Monday, May 20: White House official again says that the Treasury Department told White House Counsel Kathryn Ruemmler the week of April 22.

Jay Carney says his earlier statement and the one issued earlier today about April 22 are both wrong and that the counsel’s office were informed a week earlier, on April 16.

Jay Carney says White House Counsel Kathryn Ruemmler informed Chief of Staff Denis McDonough and other senior staff of the report. Who these other staffers are no one knows.

Jay Carney says the White House was in constant contact with the Treasury Department since before the May 10 intentional leak by IRS official Lois Lerner

Jay Carney said White House Counsel Kathryn Ruemmler and senior staff felt this was “not a matter she should convey to the president” until the report was officially released.

Jay Carney tells reporters “I said that I didn’t know (these details) until Friday, but I’m getting this information to you now.”

Stay tuned.

May 21, 2013 at 7:53 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

dude_abides said...

This is the America I want to live in, and I'm not the only one:


I know what you mean ... red state Oklahoma as compared to blue states N.J. and N.Y. recently. "Look there is nobody in that storm damaged beach house .. let's loot it"

May 21, 2013 at 7:58 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

Steve Miller acting commissioner of the IRS who resigned this week because of the scandal and Georgia Rep. Tom Price.

Here’s their exchange:

Price: Is it illegal what they’ve done?

Miller: It is absolutely not illegal.

Price: It is not illegal what the IRS has done?

Miller: So let me understand the question. What is your statement as to what is illegal?

Price: Do you believe that it is illegal for employees of the IRS to create lists, to target individual groups and citizens in this country?

Miller: I think the [Department of] Treasury inspector general indicated it might not be, but others will be able to tell that.

Price: What do you believe?

Miller: I don’t believe it is.

With all of the Butt covering going on it sure looks like they really feel that it is illegal. The lawyer sharks are lining up to get their cut of all the settlements and judgments that will result from this “legal activity”.

May 21, 2013 at 8:05 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Jt6gR3hM says: “You can’t give big money directly to candidates. Individuals can give $2600 and PAC’s $5000. . . With so much of our personal information readily available on the internet we are all subject to being threatened with it to alter our political activity. The moment that the names of donors are leaked or released opposition research begins.”

Thanks but no thanks, Jt6gR3hm. I’m not buying your argument. I also want to know specifically who is paying for all of these outrageous and irresponsible TV advertisements and literature that we typically see during our elections.

In 2006 approximately 1% of political spending - other than spending by political parties and campaign committees - did not disclose donors. This changed dramatically after the Supreme Court’s Citizens United decision. By 2010, the percentage of political spending through undisclosed donors had increased to 44%, which I find unsettling.

I believe citizens only lose when you a situation like we saw in 2012 where two of the biggest 501(c)(4) groups (Crossroads GPS and Americans for Prosperity) had put more money into the presidential campaign than all the super PACs combined.

May 21, 2013 at 8:06 p.m.
PlainTruth said...

clearly a commonuss plot here.

May 21, 2013 at 8:14 p.m.
miraweb said...

Good photo, dude. I understand that was the boy's teacher in that shot.

Glad you got some enjoyment out of "editorial benihana". :-)

May 21, 2013 at 8:32 p.m.
patriot1 said...

Taking the fifth....hmmmm, it's comforting to know those on the left at least acknowledge we still have a Bill of Rights.

May 21, 2013 at 8:51 p.m.
miraweb said...

Sweet, pure gold.

How about those 900,000 backlogged cases at the VA?

If Citizen's United swamped the IRS with thousands of non-profit applications can you imagine what two wars has done to the file clerks at the VA?

Don't forget to add in those Social Security examiners treading water under the disability applications and early retirements left over from the recession. Only 1.8 million cases to go!

What a perfect time for a sequester - only good things will come from cutting critical agency budgets - but not their workloads, right? Nothing bad could possibly happen when you put people in impossible jobs.

At least we can fly on-time.

Well done, Congress!

May 21, 2013 at 9:17 p.m.
patriot1 said...

mira.....As I have stated before on here, history didn't begin when George Bush got elected. 2.7 million uniformed military served in Vietnam and it ended while we were dealing with WWII and Korean War Veterans. Of course these were wars started during democrat adminstrations....

May 21, 2013 at 10:09 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

miraweb said...

We all know a young man or two who makes something up when the truth might serve him better.


I know what you mean as a couple of acquaintances of mine have young women friends that just can’t help themselves concerning that type of activity.

If you know what I mean?

May 21, 2013 at 10:40 p.m.
PlainTruth said...

The dupes get nervous when the sharks start circling.

May 21, 2013 at 10:56 p.m.
Maximus said...

Jodi Arias, if she avoids death penalty, will work behind bars as an IRS agent.

May 21, 2013 at 10:56 p.m.
miraweb said...

I just don't seem to remember Roosevelt being the one who bombed Pearl Harbor or invaded Poland. We are now at 2.3 million having seved in Iraq and Afghanistan. 711,000 are now getting services from the VA. Far fewer deaths than Vietnam - thank God - but more and longer individual deployments and a high rate of long-term injuries such as head trauma and PTSD.

My critique was of the Congress who have been far too busy with the eternal campaign to pay deserved attention to three agencies in meltdown.

May 21, 2013 at 11:01 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

tifosi said...

Dagum... this new socialism ain't half bad.


I know what you mean.

Its called Crony Capitalism and even that deviant version still kicks butt with old Socialism which currently is Zero for Forever.

May 21, 2013 at 11:02 p.m.
miraweb said...

Home Depot had a good quarter. Housing market is finally showing signs of life. The major economic risk is now the dysfunctional Congress.

May 21, 2013 at 11:08 p.m.
Maximus said...

Cat 5 tornado and only 24 deaths. Wow, we have made progress. Much praise to the citizens and churches of Moore that stepped up immediately after the tornado to help the victims. The state of OK is to be praised, those without homes are being provided shelter at the Univ. Of OK and OK State. FEMA arrived after much of the work had already been done. Lesson....be self reliant, expect the best but prepare for the worst. I love the way OK took care of their disaster before Barry The Welfare Pimp even made a speech. The Feds and big government especially under Obama, will not take care of you.

I am taking quotes from contractors to build a storm shelter on my property. I suggest you do the same. Take care of yourself, it takes FEMA days to arrive if it ever arrives.

May 21, 2013 at 11:10 p.m.
PlainTruth said...

Labor unions are breaking with President Obama on ObamaCare. Months after the president’s reelection, a variety of unions are publicly balking at how the administration plans to implement the landmark law. They warn that unless there are changes, the results could be catastrophic. too freakin funny

May 21, 2013 at 11:11 p.m.
dude_abides said...

JtY2K... Yeah, those are obviously republicans. LMaO

May 21, 2013 at 11:12 p.m.
dude_abides said...

maximuth said... "I am taking quotes from contractors to build a storm shelter on my property."

Doesn't your trailer have a septic tank? You've done the first part, now just fall back in it.

Hey, thanks for the update. Good to know that Oklahoma won't be needing any federal funds. Glad to hear the tragedy is over and everything is back to normal!

May 21, 2013 at 11:19 p.m.
Maximus said...

Miraweb the economy is still very bad for most of those low information voters that have bought into the food stamp lifestyle of Barry The Welfare Pimp. Continue to keep your low expectations and vote Democrat. I will continue to buy Lowes and Home Depot stock until the Barry Bubble is about to burst. Again, those who take care of themselves will always thrive. Those that depend on others, especially the government will have a sad existence. Sorry Miraweb but your utopia is a lie. Cowboy up!

May 21, 2013 at 11:19 p.m.
dude_abides said...

Maximus said... "Cowboy up!"

LOL... Is that a line out of Brokeback Mountain?

May 21, 2013 at 11:21 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

miraweb said...

I just don't seem to remember Roosevelt being the one who bombed Pearl Harbor or invaded Poland.


If you want to play that kind of game then:

The U.S.’s meddling in Asian affairs prior to World War 2 caused the Japanese to attack us according to some historians. Our attempts at boycotting Japan made them feel that was an act of war and thus they attacked us.

Germany declare war on us because we were supplying arms to their enemies and they saw that as an act of war. Even though they declared war they had no designs on conquering the U.S. or even engaging us in combat if only we had stop our gunrunning activities.

Why was it necessary for us to play policeman to the world which resulted in millions more killed than was necessary. FDR should have just stuck to his knitting and left those people alone. They weren’t bothering us until we stuck our noses into their business.

That’s how its played .. its a simple game if you are willing to disregard certain critical details

May 21, 2013 at 11:23 p.m.
Maximus said...

Dude, unlike you, I employ people and produce income during the day. As for you, keep typing your sorry life away and don't forget to pick up your EBT card. :). Oh yea maybe FEMA will bring you a trailer from Catrina soon..................now dats fuuuuuuuuuuunny.

May 21, 2013 at 11:23 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

dude_abides said...

Maximus said... "Cowboy up!"

LOL... Is that a line out of Brokeback Mountain?


I'm positive that if it was you wouldn't have had to ask.

May 21, 2013 at 11:26 p.m.
Maximus said...

Dude go back to your White Russians and weed. Nobody takes you seriously. Your hero Jeff Bridges (The Big Lebowsky)is making a fortune doing voiceovers for Kia TV commercials. I hear Jeff saw the light and became a hard working rich Republican like me. Dude contribute to Barry's IRS Gangster Thug Welfare World GET A FRUCKING J.......O........B! Maybe Clay the traumatized military brat will let you sub for him while he is on holiday. You can draw like a fourth grader, right?

May 21, 2013 at 11:31 p.m.
Jt6gR3hM said...

dude_abides said...

JtY2K... Yeah, those are obviously republicans. LMaO


I know what you mean ... red state Oklahoma as compared to blue states N.J. and N.Y. recently. "Look there is nobody in that storm damaged beach house .. let's loot it"

May 21, 2013 at 11:33 p.m.
miraweb said...

The Congress is so dedicated to taking care of the wounded warriors that they didn't even get enough storage room to hold the incoming claims. The sixth floor of a VA processing center had to be emptied when inspectors determined the 37,000 claims sitting in boxes were in danger of collapsing the floor.

Not a great week for the folks on the fifth floor.

May 21, 2013 at 11:40 p.m.
Maximus said...

OK tornado caused by global warming.....A LIE. Look at the weather records. Similar and even more powerful tornados occurred in the U.S. in the 1800's.

We have gotten much better in preparing for and predicting where the tornados will hit. Take the tornado warnings seriously. Prepare and take care of yourself. I know it's hard for some of you but Obama nor his BIG government safety net can do much to protect you from the power of nature. But for the grace of God I go.

May 21, 2013 at 11:41 p.m.
miraweb said...

Gee Maxi, I didn't know they made Barbie storm cellers.

Probably on the same aisle as My Little Pony Stock Exchange.

May 21, 2013 at 11:47 p.m.
dude_abides said...

Maximus said... "But for the grace of God I go."

You are truly an idiot. OMG

May 21, 2013 at 11:48 p.m.
Maximus said...

Nooga...the only liberals I play golf with are customers. Otherwise, I don't associate with losers that voted for Obama. It is a waste of time and time is money on the golf course.

And Miraweb.....who is ultimately in charge of the VA? The Chief Executive, Barry Cetera Obama. Don't get your hopes up, Barry The Lame Duck is coasting, sleeping through U.S, Embassy attacks, and taking walks with his girls. He will remember those walks more than he will remember what he accomplished as President.....a quote from a recent Barry speech......he was right about that.

May 21, 2013 at 11:49 p.m.
dude_abides said...

Jt6gR3hM said... dude_abides said...

JtY2K... Yeah, those are obviously republicans. LMaO

I know what you mean ... red state Oklahoma as compared to blue states N.J. and N.Y. recently. "Look there is nobody in that storm damaged beach house .. let's loot it"

Yeah, those are obviously republicans. LMaO

May 21, 2013 at 11:51 p.m.
Maximus said...

Dude...your retardation is duly noted. Web.....ToysRUs stock....not so much. Buy it in November and sell it in Feb.

May 21, 2013 at 11:52 p.m.
miraweb said...

Heck,issue your own tornado warnings! Don't be fooled by those big government dupes at the National Weather Service!

Be sure to map the damage on your own personal satellite! Landsat is just a commie plot!

May 21, 2013 at 11:53 p.m.
dude_abides said...

Maximus said... I go but for God grace there... There I go but for God grace... I grace there but go for God... Fool me once...

May 21, 2013 at 11:57 p.m.
miraweb said...

LMaO

May 21, 2013 at 11:57 p.m.
chet123 said...

ITS AMAZING THE WAY TEA-PARTY(WHO IS ACTUALLY REPUBLICAN WHO'S SHAME TO USE THE NAME REPUBLICANS)CUT AND RUN WHEN THERE'S STRONG PUSH BACK BY OPPOSITION PARTY.....

OBAMA COULD LEARN SOMETHING FROM GRASS-ROOT DEMOCRATS,...FIGHT!

May 22, 2013 at 9:31 a.m.
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