published Wednesday, February 9th, 2011

The Source

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about Clay Bennett...

The son of a career army officer, Bennett led a nomadic life, attending ten different schools before graduating in 1980 from the University of North Alabama with degrees in Art and History. After brief stints as a staff artist at the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette and the Fayetteville (NC) Times, he went on to serve as the editorial cartoonist for the St. Petersburg Times (1981-1994) and The Christian Science Monitor (1997-2007), before joining the staff of the ...

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steve_smith_tn said...

What are some of his craziest ideas?

February 9, 2011 at 1 a.m.
librul said...

Sorry, troll feeding is prohibited.

February 9, 2011 at 1:10 a.m.
Salsa said...

Is that Al Gore?

February 9, 2011 at 1:18 a.m.
blackwater48 said...

Steve Smith TN wonders, "What are some of his craziest ideas?"

Are you asking because you never heard his show? Or are you a fan and can't understand all the hubbub. Yesterday the Huffington Post ran this:

"Last week he stood at a map of the Arab states and concluded that Islam would soon be united as a caliphate stretching from Iran west to Morocco. The center, or the capital, would be Babylon, in Iraq. Beck said that President Barack Obama and President George W. Bush were complicit in this plot. What evidence did he cite? Well President Obama is, of course, a liberal. And President Bush ordered his military not to bomb Babylon, one of Islam's holiest cities, during the Iraq War."

Politics Daily offered this assessment:

"Beck depicts the Egyptian revolution as nothing more than a dark development in a covert three-dimensional global chess game that only he can suss out. The implication is that good Americans ought to fear and oppose the protests led by Egyptians calling for Hosni Mubarak's departure and democratic reforms. And conservatives who endorse the demonstrators' call for change and reforms are nothing but useful idiots doing the work of the clandestine Islamic-communist cabal.

"This latest Beck craziness has become too much for some conservatives. Bill Kristol, the top-dog neocon, gripes:

"'Hysteria is not a sign of health. When Glenn Beck rants about the caliphate taking over the Middle East from Morocco to the Philippines, and lists (invents?) the connections between caliphate-promoters and the American left, he brings to mind no one so much as Robert Welch and the John Birch Society.'"

Beck fired back: "People like Bill Kristol, I don't think they actually stand for anything anymore. All they stand for is power. . . . And really, times have changed, Bill... It's time to see the world as it really is..."

Fox "News" owner Rupert Murdoch and Chief Henchman Roger Ailes have been known to lean toward the unconventional in order to create media controversy.

It's a good way to drum up interest and make money, but both men also like to be taken seriously. Seriously! But now some conservatives are complaining that Beck has become nothing more that a, "paranoid-messianic rodeo clown."

Apparently it was hunky-dory when he said Liberals in general but Obama in particular were complicit in destroying America. He only stepped over the line when he started roping conservatives into his dark web of evil mystery.

When all is said and done, however, it appears that Beck might be right about one thing: the end, in fact, certainly appears to be nigh.

For his career.

February 9, 2011 at 1:56 a.m.
Francis said...

another bird cage lining worthy offering by that democrat party troll, bennett.

s***w you librul........any criticism of beck (which is fair game since he opens himself up to it ,since he's a media figure)....from a liberal donkey like you is a joke given the way you libs bend over for that sweaty wacko all gore, prop up an obvious liar, obama,( who is so dillusional that he can sit for a major interview before the super bowl and can say with a straight face that he didn't raise taxes),...and given the absolute trash you have selling your liberal crap in the media...like keith olberman, those dumb asses on the view, and a host of other democrat party bought hosts who pollute our lives.

February 9, 2011 at 5:36 a.m.
hambone said...

Ah, come on Francis tell us how you really fell. Your love for the Glenn Beck drivil has been obvious for a long time. So what's new.

Beck is out for Beck and as long as he can get attention from sheep like you he's happy!

February 9, 2011 at 6:34 a.m.
AndrewLohr said...

Mr. Beck may say some sensible things, but he's a Mormon, right? And the book of Mormon is a 3rd-rate fantasy novel (I've read it), so his judgment is way off in some important ways. (Same for Gov. Romney, of course, as his Massachusetts health program also shows.)

With the Bible, there's argument about whether, say, the Jews did what it says they did; but everyone agrees there are, and were, Jews. With the book of Mormon, bluntly, the question (if one calls it a question) is whether the people of anti-Nephi-Lehi, and the places mentioned, ever existed at all. A battle bigger than Gettysburg was fought in New York state sometime around A.D. 200 and left no traces? We can go to Heaven, and share in the resurrection of life, by trusting and following Jesus Christ, even if we totally ignore Joseph Smith (and Glen Beck, though Beck would in some ways improve on our currect President, I think.) s

February 9, 2011 at 6:34 a.m.
sandyonsignal said...

Perfect example, Blackwater48. When Kristol thinks someone is nuts, they have to pretty farout there. Kristol and his Neo-con following are the ones who gave us the Iraq war, stating "Iraq would be low hanging fruit" then on to Iran. All for American's energy needs.
The PNAC plan went horribly wrong resulting in close to a million civilian deaths, 4500 dead American troops, 100,000 plus wounded, unknown PTSD and TBI cases, and a trillion dollar bill. The war was based on lies and propaganda sold to Americans and some of her allies. That's just rich that Kristol chastises Beck for hysterical antics. Pot meet kettle.

February 9, 2011 at 6:41 a.m.
woody said...

I have never heard or seen Mr. Beck, in person, as it were. However, after having read the accounts of Blackwater and Francis, I get the calming feeling that I haven't missed a thing.

Additionally, I have never been assaulted by the acidic vitriol (sorry that could be construed as being redundant) spewed on a daily basis by the likes of Hannity and others, but I can remember from whence they all came.

Strangely enough, it was a fairly entertaining Sunday night on one of my long-time favorite programs "60 Minutes", when they introduced to the world the (up to that moment) nearly never of before heard of small-market radio personality Rush Limbaugh. Being a radio personality myself at the time, I watched a star being born and thought to myself..what a break..I hope he goes far.

Who knew??
But just think, if it weren't for the "main-stream media" they all decry, the likes of Limbaugh, Beck and the rest wouldn't be as big as an historical footnote in the grand scheme of things.

I may never forgive you Don Hewitt, Woody

February 9, 2011 at 6:43 a.m.
lkeithlu said...

We should celebrate this cartoon by posting Glenn Beck quotes:

"I don't think we came from monkeys. I think that's ridiculous. I haven't seen a half-monkey, half-person yet."

"If I get to the other side and God's like, 'You know what, yep, you were a monkey once,' I'll be shocked, but I'll be cool with it," he said."

February 9, 2011 at 7:27 a.m.
hambone said...

BTW. Has anyone heard that right wing nut job Lush Limpbaugh and his latest future exwife have split up and she's living in a hotel on his dime!

February 9, 2011 at 7:38 a.m.
EaTn said...

I think most realize Beck is a Rush wannabe, but what is disturbing is that some of our prominent Christian leaders stated that the Beck DC Mall show was an inspiration to all believers. Well, this is one believer who thought it rated right up there with the Grizwals' trip to Wallyworld.

February 9, 2011 at 8:10 a.m.
Francis said...

i don't have cable...or a dish......i don't watch glen beck.....

but, the fact is you libs continue to push the idea that no one can come to a conclusion on their own without listening to limbaugh, beck, hannity, levin or the like. i was a conservative long before any of them were on the radio or tv.

you don't need to listen to any conservative leaning radio or tv shows to know that a mandate to force people to buy something is unconstitutional, obama is lying when he said he hasn't raised taxes, socialism and communism have failed, nancy pelosi is an elitest snob, and the governement already collects plenty of taxes and needs to cut spending.

February 9, 2011 at 8:20 a.m.
hambone said...

I have always felt that people like Beck who have a past of over doing drugs and alcohol but have "cleaned up" are not wrapped very tight and when the pressures of their job get too heavy they begain unravel.

It appears that Ol' Glenn has hit the wall!

February 9, 2011 at 9:13 a.m.
acerigger said...

"I didn't raise taxes once," Barack Obama told Bill O'Reilly on Sunday. "I lowered taxes over the last two years." That's, well, half true. The Obama administration has raised taxes. The excise tax on high-value health-care insurance, for instance, is a tax. So is the tax on tanning salons, and the increase in cigarette taxes. These taxes -- or at least tax levels -- didn't exist before Obama signed them into law. They will raise taxes on certain people under certain circumstances. They will get bigger as the years tick by. PolitiFact rated this as "false," and rightly so.

On the other hand, Obama has lowered taxes repeatedly. He extended the Bush tax cuts. He passed a payroll tax holiday. He passed the Making Work Pay tax cut. Overall, he's been big on tax cuts and very reluctant to consider higher income or payroll taxes as a way to fund programs or close the deficit. As PolitiFact says, "most Americans have seen lower taxes."(ezra klein)

February 9, 2011 at 9:20 a.m.
blackwater48 said...

So far only Francis and Andrew are in Beck's corner. Francis fervently defends him because he's conservative, but it's blind loyalty because he's never heard Beck's program.

Andrew is less enthusiastic because Glen is a Mormon, but thinks he'd still be a better President than Obama.

Andrew even said Beck says "sensible things." I challenge that. Andrew, please provide some sensible political or conspiratorial statements Glen has made on air. There must be something. You would love to see him President! Maybe love is too strong a word. You would PREFER him over Obama so, I guess, what's love got to do with it?

Francis, you're excused. Unless you can channel specific Beck quotes that won't set you off on another rant about that tax raising commie liar idiot...oh never mind.

No other defenders? Apologists? Translators?

February 9, 2011 at 9:30 a.m.
pmcauley said...

I suppose it's possible for Beck to be as ill informed as he portrays, but I suspect it's for the contraversy and therefore the money. That level of stupidity would take a lot of work.

Also telling is the fact that Francis’ rant that has the same tone and content about something he admits he has no knowledge (Not seen Beck) as drivel he sputters about stuff he calims to more knowledge. Maybe he has a random drivel generator.

X=Problem; “X is Obama's fault and the rest of you communist horde…X did not exist before the lib got power (sputter, sputter)…If we wish to get rid of X vote conservative…Oh and by the way Obama is not American… etc… etc…” excuse the spittle pm

February 9, 2011 at 9:34 a.m.
fairmon said...

Wody,

Woody I hope watching a star be born doesn't equate to being a fan. Rush "ROAR" Limbaugh is a piece of work. TV personalities are exactly the same as politicians seeking votes in order to retain their position of power and prestige. Both react to ratings or polls and adjust their clatter accordingly. They try to carve out a niche audience. Some use the republicans and some use the democrats. The same is true for print media. Wouldn't it be nice if all the facts were provided with no twist by the journalist or the presenting personality.

I haven't seen Beck's comments but it sounds like he may be referring to Iran when it was Persia and may be suggesting they are seeking to regain control of the prior domain. I am suspicion of anyone pretending to understand Shiites, Sunnies or other tribes in the region and Sharia law. Those that believe all or most of them will ever evolve to a peaceful democratic form of government are probably naive. Beck and Bahner can both tear up on demand and according to the script. Pelosi and Olberman both use their man made plastic smiles effectively. The point is neither party has the best interest of the country as a priority nor do those gaining wealth as a media personality.

February 9, 2011 at 9:36 a.m.

I've watched Beck. He's not a gloom and doomer as Bennett would want you to believe with this 5th grade cartoon effort. But he does follow and report on the shinanigans of the wacky left wing nut jobs so maybe Claydo is on to something.

And only a liberal (acerigger) would claim a lowering of the income tax rate when in fact it was maintaining the current rates.

Andyes, several taxes have increased under the Obama regime. But he won't be bothered with the small details. Remember, he's the smartest person in the room.

February 9, 2011 at 9:52 a.m.
Clara said...

Can't contribute because, aside from an ad I get for Tox-ick via e-mail, I seldom watch the Web site. If it's a video, it takes me an hour to download a five minute or less segment. Print and pictures isn't too bad.

What I have seen or heard, however, is not to my liking.

I heard Rush on radio years ago, one time, and never listened again.

February 9, 2011 at 10:13 a.m.
Clara said...

Am I missing something funny?

February 9, 2011 at 10:16 a.m.
blackwater48 said...

Harp wrote something that struck a chord: "Wouldn't it be nice if all the facts were provided with no twist by the journalist or the presenting personality."

The press has become nothing more than a conduit connecting political PR machines peddling focus-group-tested sound bites to the public. The media "report" so and so saying this and that. Never question the accuracy, never point out why the speaker might have a political axe to grind, never offer facts that might interfere with the fable.

The latest drivel about the legend of Ronald Reagan is just the latest example. Good grief.

Journalist only want the story. They forget that they are suppose to INFORM the public, not just give the spin doctors the spotlight and step aside. The fact that we have a service called Politifact is indictment enough of our current state of the media. I think both sides of the political spectrum would agree on that.

Left with this informational vacuum, the talking heads have taken over the "news." Glen Beck is just another hack who has gained way too much power and way too much credibility.

February 9, 2011 at 10:59 a.m.
hambone said...

I'm retired so all my income is fixed. However my wife still works and is paid the same salary as last year.

Her take home has gone up 3.8% over last year.

To me that's lower taxes!

February 9, 2011 at 11:08 a.m.
blackwater48 said...

Hambone, get real. Who are you going to believe? Republicans or your lying eyes?

February 9, 2011 at 11:19 a.m.
steve_smith_tn said...

Beck is crazy if he thinks our Presidents are complicit in some kind of plot. Beck is a huckster. He is no Walter Cronkite. We all know it. He knows it too. He does have a value, though. He highlights things our Media neglects.

German Chancellor Merkel and British Prime Minister Cameron have both come out against "multiculturalism" recently. Everyone knows they aren't talking about the Swiss. The western world has a growing problem on its hands. Are Merkel and Cameron crazy too? Where is Katie Couric on this issue when you need her? Whoopie? Joy Behar?

February 9, 2011 at 11:35 a.m.
pmcauley said...

I agree with Steve. "Main stream" media have been very silent on many issues. I long for the days with real investigative journalists. Their contribution can be great. We now get a continual stream of meaningless pabulum.

Most news organizations get their information directly from the companies; political parties; governments; etc in the form of news releases which they happily reprint verbatim.

sigh, pm

February 9, 2011 at 11:49 a.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Blackwater48 aaid: “So far only Francis and Andrew are in Beck's corner.”

Yes, I suspect Francis and Andrew are eagerly waiting to get their personal invitations to the Mad Hater’s Tea Party . . . The scene is fixed in their minds . . . (A table set under a tree. Starched Hair and the Mad Hater throwing teacups at each other. . . Enter Sarah, dressed as Alice.)

THE MAD HATER: Who are you? Get out. There's no more room at this Tea Party!

SARAH: My name is Sarah. And you must be the Mad Hatter, though you look an awful lot like Bill O'Reilly.

THE MAD HATER: I'm not the Mad Hatter. I'm the Mad Hater. And there's no more room!

SARAH: Isn't this Wonderland?

THE MAD HATER: You're way off. Wonderland is over there on the left bank of nowhere. This place is called Blunderland.

SARAH: If you're the Mad Hater, then I guess your friend is the March Hare, though he looks an awful lot like Glen Beck.

STARCHED HAIR: My name is Starched Hair, if you please. And I say, Off with your head!

SARAH: That's the Queen of Hearts's line, Off with your head. Anyway, I need my head to support my brains.

THE MAD HATER: There's no room here for Red Queens or any other Commie sympathizers.

STARCHED HAIR: No room, no room!

SARAH: Where I hail from, there's plenty of room! Living space is what makes our country exceptionalist. (And she plunks herself down in one of the armchairs) Open country. Fresh air. Wide sea lanes. Drill, baby, drill.

THE MAD HATER: Silence. I'm the only one around here allowed to rant and rave. Except for me, this is a quiet retreat.

SARAH: Never retreat. Advance! Reload!

STARCHED HAIR: Now you're talking language I can understand. Here, have a cup of tea.

SARAH: (Eagerly pouring) You betcha!

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/robert-brustein/sarah-in-blunderland-or-t_b_815134.html

[Sarah in Blunderland or Mad Hater's Tea Party - Robert Brustein]

February 9, 2011 at 12:12 p.m.
acerigger said...

"And only a liberal (acerigger) would claim a lowering of the income tax rate when in fact it was maintaining the current rates."Username: bookieturnersghost | On: February 9, 2011 at 9:52 a.m. Where in my post(from an article written by Ezra Klein) was such a claim made? Only a winger could make that jump. (R.I.P.)

February 9, 2011 at 12:13 p.m.
EaTn said...

Regarding the above posted debates on Obama's lower taxes..some front page headlines the past week post that taxes are the lowest they've been in 50 years. As a general Obama supporter, if this statement is a fact, it's really not something to shout about because the flip side of the coin is that the defecit is also a record. The economy has been through the roughest I've seen in my lifetime, and only a small percent of the wealthier in this country have been untouched by it. I doubt the middle class will ever totally recover, but sometimes perseverance makes us tougher.

February 9, 2011 at 12:29 p.m.
alprova said...

Hambone wrote: "BTW. Has anyone heard that right wing nut job Lush Limpbaugh and his latest future exwife have split up and she's living in a hotel on his dime![?]"


Didn't they just get married?

February 9, 2011 at 12:29 p.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

It seems to me that Beck puts far more research into his theories than the vast majority of the media. They have been trying to discredit him for years but things he says have a nasty habit of coming true.

The really funny part about this cartoon is that it is no less than "clay bennett" challenging the credibility of Glenn Beck. Now THAT is funny!

February 9, 2011 at 12:31 p.m.
alprova said...

BW48 wrote: "So far only Francis and Andrew are in Beck's corner. Francis fervently defends him because he's conservative, but it's blind loyalty because he's never heard Beck's program."


You're not really buying that, are you? That man lives and breathes Fox News. His comments are practically a carbon copy of what is uttered on air.


"Andrew is less enthusiastic because Glen is a Mormon, but thinks he'd still be a better President than Obama."


Is that what he was attempting to impart? I was marveling in wonder at what he had written, and was wondering just how much he had imbibed prior to typing.


"Andrew even said Beck says "sensible things."..."


In all the years that Glenn Beck has been around, even when I was a die hard Republican (And yes I was at one time), I never could listen to that man on the radio for more than five minutes. Beck has always been way out there.


"No other defenders? Apologists? Translators?"


Translators is the correct term. Beckians have no clue what the man says or stands for day to day, but they like him for some reason.

February 9, 2011 at 12:43 p.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

Username: blackwater48 | On: February 9, 2011 at 1:56 a.m.

BW, somehow I doubt you are a regular Beck viewer. It looks like you are very authoritatively regurgitating the Huffington Post.

Would that be a fair assessment?

February 9, 2011 at 12:50 p.m.
SavartiTN said...

Maybe Francis writes for Beck. Sounds like it.

February 9, 2011 at 1 p.m.
SBrauer said...

For those of you who DO listen to Beck, how many times have you heard him say "Don't take my word for it. Look it up yourself".

He is Morman, but he never tried to convert anyone to Mormanism on TV or radio.

Has he been right or wrong in what he says? If you haven't listened to him you really can't answer that, can you??

Did Obama really say "I haven't raised taxes"? Yes he did say it. It's just that he's a lying sack of poopoo. Yes our glorious leader is a scumbag.

Go for it, Francis and Andrew. I'm with you too.

February 9, 2011 at 1:03 p.m.
alprova said...

BRP wrote: "It seems to me that Beck puts far more research into his theories than the vast majority of the media."


Is that a fact? No it's not.


"They have been trying to discredit him for years but things he says have a nasty habit of coming true."


Well, let's see. He predicted on the air that personal computers would be taken over if people accessed the cars.gov website for the Cash for Clunkers program.

He's predicted that a civilian national security force would be trained and ready to take over the country on orders from President Obama.

He predicted that the U.S. would experience a "Weimar Moment" on November 3rd of last year.

He's predicted that FEMA camps would be built for the purpose of "reeducation."

Glenn Beck has proven himself to be Nostrudumbass.


"The really funny part about this cartoon is that it is no less than "clay bennett" challenging the credibility of Glenn Beck. Now THAT is funny!"


Glenn Beck has no credibility to challenge. The man is strictly an entertainer and laughs at all you folks who worship him.

February 9, 2011 at 1:09 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

BigRidgePatriot said: "It seems to me that Beck puts far more research into his theories than the vast majority of the media."

You can’t be serious, BigRidgePatriot? One doesn’t even want to think about nightly news if this were the case - it would be a nightmare. Do you read Jeffrey Goldberg? He recently responded to Beck’s "predictions" about Ancient Babylon and the coming of the collapse in “Glen Beck Is Right." Goldberg was using Beck's style of reasoning, of course, and it goes like this:

“. . . Of course, the conspiracy goes deeper than Beck has yet revealed; I'm hoping that, in coming days, if the Freemasons, working in concert with Hezbollah and the Washington Redskins, don't succeed in suppressing the truth, that Beck will reveal the identities of the most pernicious players in this grotesque campaign to subvert our way of life. I can't reveal too much here, but I think it's fair to say that Beck will be paying a lot of attention in the coming weeks to the dastardly, pro-caliphate work of Joy Behar; the makers of Little Debbie snack cakes; the 1980s hair band Def Leppard; Omar Sharif; and the Automobile Association of America. And remember, you read it here first."

http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2011/02/glenn-beck-is-right/70945/

[“Glen Beck is Right” - Jeffrey Goldberg/The Atlantic]

February 9, 2011 at 1:14 p.m.
woody said...

Harp..I think you may stopped reading too soon. No, I am not a fan, but thanks for asking so I could make that point clear....

And to PM..I got a really good laugh out of your earlier post..so good, in fact, I could almost feel the "spittle" as it flew...Eeewwwww

Still giggling, Woody

February 9, 2011 at 1:45 p.m.
blackwater48 said...

BRP tried to nail me with, "BW, somehow I doubt you are a regular Beck viewer. It looks like you are very authoritatively regurgitating the Huffington Post. Would that be a fair assessment?"

Never said I was a regular Becklodite, but how you were able to deduce that Huffington Post is one of several websites that I peruse is a remarkable demonstration of investigative journalism.

At 1:56 I wrote, "Yesterday the Huffington Post ran this:"

I guess you stopped reading because right after that you missed, "Politics Daily offered this assessment:"

I also like Politico and The Daily Beast among others. I watch 'Nightline (ABC), 'Charlie Rose' (PBS), and Fareed Zakaria's Global Public Square (CNN) among others. I am wary of stories that have just one source.

I try point out, for example, that my statistics come from the CBO or OMB or census data or wherever. That way you, yes you Big Ridge Patriot, could actually challenge my claims and (gasp!) draw your own conclusions.

Seems like most of your facts originate in your under active imagination. You claim, for instance, that many of Glen Beck's predictions have come true. That seems to be a quantifiable conclusion so you should have little trouble providing examples to back your claim.

I don't have an agenda. How about you?

February 9, 2011 at 1:48 p.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

alprova and mountainlaurel,

I am not in a position to challenge your specific claims as I can't claim to be a Glenn Beck regular. I have watched him on several occasions and I can say that it seemed quite clear that he was digging into things much deeper than your average... investigative... journalist?

alprova,

Your specific examples do not ring true to me. I do remember Beck talking about the Weimar Republic and using it as an example of why monetizing debt is a dangerous practice. He was saying stuff like “I hope I am wrong” and was not making any specific predictions, certainly not naming dates. Are you saying that on a specific date he predicted that we are heading for a Weimar moment or that he said we would have a Weimar moment that would begin on 3 November, or as I think might be the most accurate statement, he said that the Fed first promised that it would not monetize the debt, than it was caught monetizing the debt, then it declared a policy of quantitative easing which is just another name for monetizing the debt and that this practice could trigger hyperinflation similar to that experienced by the Weimar Republic when it printed money to pay off its war debt from WWI?

He was digging up evidence that the Fed was monetizing the debt long before the MSM news and long before the FED admitted it.

I do remember he was predicting the financial collapse a couple of years before it happened and everyone was calling him a Nostrudumbass at the time for that too.

Most of what you are talking about looks like topics he has covered and pointed out how similar things could be happening today. To say they are concrete predictions, rather than warnings, is probably not accurate.

You all have motivated me to set the DVR to get caught up on what he is up to these days. I stopped watching quite a while ago when it seemed like he was getting preachy about how to get through a second, deeper collapse that could be on the horizon.

February 9, 2011 at 2:11 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

SBrauer Said: “For those of you who DO listen to Beck, how many times have you heard him say
"Don't take my word for it. Look it up yourself".

Please, SBrauer. Get serious. . . It’s not too difficult to understand why Glen Beck offers his standard - Don’t take my word for it. Look it up yourself - option for his viewers.

He does it because even he knows that practically every word he says is nonsense, and any viewer that actually tries to verify his alledged facts, will end up going nuts - just like him.

Indeed, I bet you didn’t try to look up this Glen Beck quote about “Ancient Babylon” provided by Goldberg on the The Atlantic web site - talk about Beck ramblings:

“Morocco -- important, significant al-Qaeda activity. The king has been battling. But if you go back here, you have - - remember, this is Iraq. Look at what you're surrounded by.

Iraq is really important, especially to the Shiites, especially to the Twelvers who are in charge of this country right now. Because what is in Iraq? There's one place that we told our bombers not to bomb. Does anybody know what it was?

Two wars in Iraq. We said no bombing there. Ancient Babylon. Ancient Babylon. Why? Because the Bible tells us that that is the seat -- right here -- of power of a global, evil empire.

Well, that's also where the 12th imam from Iran is supposedly going to show up. Everybody on this side wants ancient Babylon for their caliphate.” [Beck]

http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2011/02/glenn-beck-is-right/70945/

[“Glen Beck is Right” - Jeffrey Goldberg/The Atlantic]

February 9, 2011 at 2:18 p.m.

woody wrote “ … if it weren't for the ‘main-stream media’ they all decry, the likes of Limbaugh, Beck and the rest wouldn't be as big as an historical footnote in the grand scheme of things.”

Agreed, but for different reasons. (See below)

harp3339 wrote: “TV personalities are exactly the same as politicians seeking votes in order to retain their position of power and prestige. Both react to ratings or polls and adjust their clatter accordingly. They try to carve out a niche audience … Wouldn't it be nice if all the facts were provided with no twist by the journalist or the presenting personality … The point is neither party has the best interest of the country as a priority nor do those gaining wealth as a media personality.”

No news source is completely objective. Nor can they be. We can hope things get better than they are now in this regard, but the best response is to log off for a few days, read some great literature, histories, and well-researched, thoughtful cultural criticism, including some by representatives of ideologies with which we disagree. I know, I know. I’m a hypocrite by virtue of posting this. Indeed, I am part of the problem. Apart from something along those lines, however, citizens are unable to see through the biases on both sides and arrive at their own conclusion (which doesn’t entail occupying the fearful, mushy middle).

Your comment brought to mind some historical context about our mutual concern. Before talk radio, cable news, and the internet, conservatives were shut out of mainstream news outlets. One had to work hard to find any alternative to liberal rants disguised as objective reporting. The reason media conservatives and their audiences seem fit to be tied - even when they win elections - is due to pent-up rage over the relentless caricatures and marginalization of their values on the part of liberal power elites.

Without the war in Iraq, Democrats would have been less confident nominating someone as untested as Barak Obama. If they had elected someone more willing to govern with bi-partisan input than Obama has been (until last month), there would be no Tea Party or Sarah Palin on the national political stage. And without her all-but-certain 2012 nomination by the GOP, Obama would never be able to cruise to the victory he will win next year.

February 9, 2011 at 2:30 p.m.

I also love the reversal of tone when Congress or the Presidency changes hands to the other party. The victors spend the coming years chanting “Give the guy a break. He’s doing the best he can. There are other forces responsible for our problems. At least he’s not as bad as his devilish predecessor. If everyone would go on autopilot and chant “Yes” instead of “No,” he would finally be able to eliminate what’s wrong with the world.”

The defeated resume their rants (from 10-20 years ago) that the public was hoodwinked due to the machinations of some conspiratorial power structure (media, Wall St., etc.). Everything the victor(s) implement is a sign that “the end is nigh” and that the best use of our energies is to immerse ourselves in partisan media outlets (that feeds our rage) and throw the rascals out next time.

The cartoon makes a valid point, but it could have easily substituted Noam Chomsky as the reporter and a raving hippie wearing the placard warning of doom.

Aren’t we all what’s wrong with the world?

February 9, 2011 at 2:31 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Alprova said: “Glenn Beck has proven himself to be Nostrudumbass.”

Believe you're right, Alprova. [grin] This along with the things Michael O’Hare has noted:

"Glenn Beck has revealed himself, finally, as a covert agent of the communist/socialist left-Islamic-fanatic-Code Pink-Obama-fluoridation-currency-abasing-job-killing conspiracy. . . Beck advances his masters’ designs by describing just enough of the plotters’ workings . . . to conceal the key coordinating element that would allow us to defend ourselves.

What keystone is missing from Beck’s carefully crafted deception? What central coordinating power . . . has he absolutely refused to . . . name? Think back to the small ads with pyramids on the inside covers of comic books and Popular Mechanics, and to matchbooks . . .

The Rosicrucians! Alchemists (think it’s an accident that wingers are trying to put us on a gold standard?), Freemasons (the Shriners have a crescent right in their trademark, for Pete’s sake!), international (what more do you need to know?). Code Pink? It’s a code alright, but it’s code for Rosae Crucis!

Beck has never once named this central organizing fraternity of menace obviously pulling the strings, and if you think it’s an oversight, you don’t understand what an agent of disinformation is. . . How many Rosicrucians are already in place in your company, or the Congress, or planning havoc . . . or blogging to each other in the cipher only they understand?"

http://www.samefacts.com/2011/02/secrecy-in-government/glenn-beck-minion-of-the-great-conspiracy/

February 9, 2011 at 3:23 p.m.
potcat said...

Hey BigRidge you need to reach up and adjust those LITTLE silver things onyour head.You cant possiby believe what you wrote about the 13th Deciple beck.As for credibility yours just flew out the door.

February 9, 2011 at 3:30 p.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

Username: mountainlaurel | On: February 9, 2011 at 3:23 p.m.

That would be because there is no central organizing fraternity. That seems to be a red herring you have created to use to discredit Beck. There are various groups that are not satisfied with the status quo that would like to use chaos as a motor for change. These groups may form associations when it is convenient in order to advance their own agenda, the enemy of my enemy is my friend.

It is no wackier than the US supporting the Shaw of Iran or Mubarak.

February 9, 2011 at 3:31 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

BigRidgePatriot said: "I can't claim to be a Glenn Beck regular."

I tried to watch once, BigRidgePatriot, but think I only lasted around ten minutes. Now, I just read the occasional quotes that others have noted in their articles. I guess I relate to the woman in Clay Bennett's cartoon - the one that is moving her small child away from Glen Beck's mentor.

February 9, 2011 at 3:39 p.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

Username: potcat | On: February 9, 2011 at 3:30 p.m.

I suppose the cartoon is credible then? Come on guys. No one is claiming that everything Beck says is correct. You are just trying to kill opposing viewpoints. One thing that has become PERFECTLY clear to me from following this forum is that the progressives view it as somehow worthwhile or even critical to discredit and drown out opposing viewpoints.

The left does not seem to enjoy the debate. They seem desperate to avoid having to compare their ideas to other opinions. There is no freedom of thought for the left, only their dogma.

February 9, 2011 at 3:39 p.m.
potcat said...

Arent we all whats wrong with the world? The Question is WHERE IS THE LOVE Man!

February 9, 2011 at 3:45 p.m.
potcat said...

Wrong agin BigRidge I love opposing views. I would never want you or beck to shut up. You guys are fuel to lazy thinking and your a RIOT!

February 9, 2011 at 4:08 p.m.
whatsthefuss said...

Francis, I hope your OK after your fall. If hambonemoan and his 6:34 am post hadn't informed us of this fact we would have never known. It makes me sad that no one on here has shown any concern for you well being. Hope your OK!!! . I also love ham's comment about fixed income. The only people who have a guarantee of making the same money as the prevous year are the people collecting SS and a pension so far. My wife worked at the same job last year as the last 5 years but somehow she earned $9,200 dollars less last year. It seems to have something to do with the economy. Go figure. The funny part is when she contributed a minimum of $2,500 to her IRA the government added $2,000 to our tax return. I just love that FREETAXUSA website. It allows you to file for free or close to it with free direct deposit and you can continue to change the numbers until they work to your best advantage. Imagine the government giving you $2,000 for investing $2,500 in your retirement account??? This America is a beautiful thing. Sounds like something Glenn Beck might tell you. But I'm sure he would just be repeating something he overheard from some ranting loon walking the street in a stupor!!!

February 9, 2011 at 4:10 p.m.
blackwater48 said...

BRP said, "No one is claiming that everything Beck says is correct. You are just trying to kill opposing viewpoints."

No. I asked you to produce something, anything, just one prediction he every made that came true. That really should be easy. He could have predicted that Green Bay would win the Super Bowl, but connecting his Woodrow Wilson or Teddy Roosevelt dots might take a little leg work.

Then you said: "The left does not seem to enjoy the debate. They seem desperate to avoid having to compare their IDEAS to other OPINIONS."

Did you mean comparing facts to fables?

If you only want to prove your opinion is more valid than someone else that's one thing. I suppose you could call it a debate but it sounds more like grounds for a fist fight.

You're entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts.

Then you said, "There is no freedom of thought for the left, only their dogma." Funny, but many conservatives on this post seem to derive most of their information from Fox "News." Maybe they think that by watching O'Reilly, Hannity, Palin, Beck, et.al, proves they are open minded to information from multiple sources.

I find it fascinating that many Obama critics begin by saying something like, 'everybody knows,' or 'it's common knowledge that...'

Once I posted Department of Commerce monthly job numbers to show that the private sector has been adding workers albeit not at a pace economics would like. A right winger proclaimed something like, what a lot of hooey. Everybody knows we've been losing jobs every month.

So, when I asked this person to please show me where the private sector is losing jobs he had nothing. I think he called me a stupid head.

Is that what you mean by liberals trying to kill debate? It's an honest question. You keep going back to this point but I've never figured out what you are talking about.

February 9, 2011 at 4:21 p.m.
steve_smith_tn said...

It looks like folks on here think there is some kind of prize for "winning." The exchanges here look like a competition. This cartoonist gets paid to be on a team. Do you?

If you have watched Glenn Beck (not just snippets on MSNBC) there is no way you can come away and not say I learned something. You don't have to agree with the guy's overarching philosophy about governance to admit he occasionally gets things right. If you can't watch something you disagree with for more than 10 minutes - you've got issues. Why would someone want to comment extensively about something they have no personal knowledge of?

I saw a Beck episode once where he displayed an American flag with corporate logos instead of stars. I'm sure most all of you would have given him an attaboy for that show. It fundamentally changed the way I look at the Democrats and Republicans.

Step back. Go slow. Is there nothing good and valuable about your discourse with the other side? Maybe the guy you're talking to is a dumb ass. Does it help to call him out on it. Isn't it enough to take the high road and politely disagree. Nobody is smarter than all of us. All of us includes President Obama and Glenn Beck. It includes you too if you want to be included.

February 9, 2011 at 5:33 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Steve_Smith_Tn Said: “If you can't watch something you disagree with for more than 10 minutes - you've got issues. Why would someone want to comment extensively about something they have no personal knowledge of?”

Speaking from experience, I’d say a distaste for “hate rhetoric” is most likely one of those issues – it might appeal to you, but it doesn’t appeal everybody, Steve_Smith_Tn.

I must also say that 10 minutes of “hate rhetoric” can reveal quite a bit about a person, and if you’re the listener, you do gain personal knowledge about the speaker - too much, I'd say.

February 9, 2011 at 6:14 p.m.
steve_smith_tn said...

Mountain Laurel

Is it possible the word hate is thrown around a little too loosely. Do we really all hate one another? Really? Just this week I disciplined my son for his over use of the word hate. He hates onions. He hates putting on socks. He's four.

There is real hate in the world. It is ugly. I deal with it and its aftermath occasionally. Hate wounds people and it has nothing to do with feelings or emotions or ideas.

The stuff we see on the t.v. that garners millions of viewers isn't hate. Rachel Maddow doesn't spew hate. Keith Olbermann doesn't spew hate. Neither does Beck and Limbaugh. Its easier to dismiss them if we just label them hate-mongers. It eliminates the effort of having to actually think about what they are saying. There is an attitude that if they play on the other team, everything about them is wrong, they are stupid best case and full of hate worst case. Even though they all seem to be disingenuous at times to me, I wouldn't personally describe them as hateful. The Westboro Baptist folks - yeah, I think that lunacy is hateful.

Here is the danger I see out of loose language: perceiving that one is hated makes it easier to really hate others. It makes it easier to be intolerant. It stifles communication, It creates a herd mentality. It has a counterpart on the right. Instead of hate, the right bandies about the term "liberal." It no longer has much meaning. Instead of meaning someone who loves freedom, now it just means "them."

So if "haters" versus" libruls" is about as much sophistication as one can handle, well . . . each of us have different viewpoints. Good luck learning anything you don't already know.

February 9, 2011 at 6:53 p.m.
hambone said...

steve_smith_tn, Goldline is ready when you are!

February 9, 2011 at 7:16 p.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

Username: blackwater48 | On: February 9, 2011 at 4:21 p.m.

One idea would be the prediction of the financial meltdown while Barney Frank and everyone was saying everything was just peachy. Beck was way ahead of the curve on that very important prediction. If you are not willing to give him that then I don't know what else to tell ya, other than you clearly do not know what you are talking about.

Many of you should go back and read your posts. You start from the assumption that Beck (read: anyone not clearly a progressive) is crazy, or dumb, or something like that.

You seem to be cut from the same cloth as clay and that I suppose is why you love him so much. We have this guy out there named Glenn Beck who looks to me to be trying his best to sort out the craziness that surrounds us. He has done a lot of ground breaking work. You guys seem to get your impression of him from the Huffington Post and feel free to disregard everything he does without ever watching more than a few minutes of his show. Your loss.

February 9, 2011 at 7:38 p.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

Username: potcat | On: February 9, 2011 at 4:08 p.m. “Wrong agin BigRidge I love opposing views. I would never want you or beck to shut up. You guys are fuel to lazy thinking and your a RIOT!”

Case in point. potcat does not want to discuss any issues, he/she just wants to ridicule someone that does not hold the same opinion. If there was any interest at all in the ideas he/she would be talking about them instead of making unfounded attacks. I suspect that this causes a warm wave of feelings of superiority and security wash over potcat. Whatever.

February 9, 2011 at 7:48 p.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

Username: steve_smith_tn | On: February 9, 2011 at 6:53 p.m.

I think your post is right on. Thanks.

February 9, 2011 at 7:52 p.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

Username: mountainlaurel | On: February 9, 2011 at 6:14 p.m. "Speaking from experience, I’d say a distaste for “hate rhetoric” is most likely one of those issues – it might appeal to you, but it doesn’t appeal everybody"

Another example: Dismiss an opposing viewpoint as "Hate Speech". I have sat through several of Glenn Beck's shows and can say without a doubt that this is an unfair characterization of his show.

February 9, 2011 at 7:59 p.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

For BW:

"Good for you, you have a heart, you can be a liberal. Now, couple your heart with your brain, and you can be a conservative." Glenn Beck

Sounds like something you keep saying.

February 9, 2011 at 8:26 p.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

Username: lkeithlu | On: February 9, 2011 at 7:27 a.m.

“I think every American has a role in saving this country. Whether you're Democrat, Republican, independent, it doesn't matter. We all know the country's in trouble. We may disagree on how to solve it, but we all know the country's in trouble.” Glenn Beck

February 9, 2011 at 8:29 p.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

I thought this one perfectly matches what I have been trying to say...

"Political Correctness doesn't change us, it shuts us up." Glenn Beck

February 9, 2011 at 8:32 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

BigRidgePatriot said” “Dismiss an opposing viewpoint as "Hate Speech". I have sat through several of Glenn Beck's shows and can say without a doubt that this is an unfair characterization of his show."

Actually, BigRidgePatriot, I usually find discussions with people who have opposing political views to be interesting and a lot of fun – the exception, of course, is the Glen Beck types.

Per your comment about Beck's show, I can only say that I heard what I heard, BigRidgePatriot. And since outrageous Beck quotes continue to appear in the news rather frequently, I suspect his program hasn’t changed much since the evening I tried to watch it.

And what I do read is often unsettling. Several weeks ago, I recall reading a news article about a 78 year-old college professor who had started receiving death threats after being vilified by Beck on his show - this kind of thing doesn't occur as a result of "love" rhetoric.

February 9, 2011 at 8:54 p.m.
canarysong said...

mountainlaurel;

I have been following the same story. To make matters worse, the 78 year old professor is a woman, a widow, who is being demonized and hounded for views that she expressed back in the 1960s(?) I believe. He has continued to harp on this despite the repeated death threats against her.

Tough guy, heh?

February 9, 2011 at 9:19 p.m.

mountainlaurel,

Are you sure you know the meaning of vilify? You might want to look it up. It has a long list of your comments as examples of the meaning.

(I have never heard Glen Beck and could care less what his fans or critics say about him.)

February 9, 2011 at 9:22 p.m.

(See also "smear campaign.")

February 9, 2011 at 9:48 p.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

I just finished watching an episode of Glenn Beck on the DVR. I have to tell you, I got about 100 times more out of that hour than I did exchanging "ideas" with this crowd for a week. Towards the end of the program he shared the David Crocket quote (I am a huge fan of David Crocket.), "You can all go to hell; I will go to Texas”.

It occurred to me that I could use a similar sentiment towards the progressives here, but I am pretty sure I will be back to continue to bestow you all with just a sliver of the kind of thinking that made David Crocket such a great man. Clearly though, life is too short to spend as much time here as I have.

Cheers!

February 9, 2011 at 10 p.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

Username: canarysong | On: February 9, 2011 at 9:19 p.m.

Who are you talking about? Who is this poor old lady professor that has had to deal with her past because Beck continues to drag it back up. Piven?

February 9, 2011 at 10:05 p.m.
steve_smith_tn said...

I hadn't heard about this death threat story so I read a little about it. It appears the 78 year old professor is Frances Pivens. She is/was a political science professor that penned a sixties article about the federalization of welfare. I just read the article. Its fairly short. It is basically a proto-entitlement argument that advocates the collection of political power through the federalization of welfare. Here is a quote, in fact the last sentences of the article:

"If organizers can deliver millions of dollars in cash benefits to the ghetto masses, it seems reasonable to expect that the masses will deliver their loyalties to their benefactors. At least, they have always done so in the past."

Basically it advocates racial identity politics and class warfare. It seems to predict basically the entire Johnson Great Society effort and the resulting mess we have today in our inner cities.

I don't know much about the death threats. It seems the reports are of comments left on blogs. While I am not excusing uncivil internet blog behavior, there is a big difference between a death threat (which should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law) and anonymous idiots on blogs. There are filters and administrators for that kind of thing.

Evidently, Ms. Pivens wrote another more recent article that was reportedly mischaracterized as a call to violence, a la leftist violence in Greece. I haven't been able to find it. But nonetheless, I don't get the feeling Professor Pivens is a shrinking violet. If she shares any blame for the massive Johnson boondoggle, she deserves infamy for it. It is something in this era of entitlement spending that we need to know more about, not less.

If we squelch speech because the readers of it say unkind and hateful things, if we impute the hatred of the reader to the writer, we might all as well shut up. I don't think anyone serious, left, right or center wants that. Only people who want to win at all costs would silence their adversaries. That is un-American.

February 9, 2011 at 10:05 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Canarysong said: "I have been following the same story. To make matters worse, the 78 year old professor is a woman, a widow, who is being demonized and hounded for views that she expressed back in the 1960s."

Apparently, the Center for Constitutional Rights has written an appeal to Fox News president Ailes in an effort to help put a stop to threats against this professor. CCR’s appeal details some of the incendiary quotes from Beck as well as some of violent “viewer” quotes that appear on Beck’s website - neither Beck’s nor the viewer quotes appear to very healthy to me.

February 9, 2011 at 10:15 p.m.
BigRidgePatriot said...

Username: steve_smith_tn | On: February 9, 2011 at 10:05 p.m.

Sure enough, I found similar things. Maybe now canarysong and mountainlaurel will come out of the closet and name thier sources so we can decide without their filter if Piven is any kind of a victim or if she is just an old die-hard socialist that will not go away and needs to be talked about because progressive leaders still give her thoughts time.

February 9, 2011 at 10:25 p.m.
mountainlaurel said...

Steve_Smith_Tn said: "I don't know much about the death threats. It seems the reports are of comments left on blogs. "

Per your comment, this news release info is from an appeal issued January 20, 2011 by the Center for Constitutional Rights to Fox News president Roger Ailes:

". . . The CCR letter cites many of the incendiary quotes from Beck in reference to Piven. Beck compares Piven to the Hutaree militia, infamous for violent threats against government and law enforcement workers, and equates her calls for social movements to “terrorism.” On December 31, a headline on The Blaze read, “Frances Fox Piven Rings in the New Year by Advocating Violent Revolution,” further stating that “violence has always been Piven’s preferred method of collapse.”

The Center for Constitutional rights details a backlash through some of the many violent quotes on Beck’s website. Examples include, “Maybe they should burst through the front door of this arrogant elitist and slit the hateful cow’s throat,” “We should blow up Piven’s office and home,” and “I am all for violence and change Frances: Where do your loved ones live?”

The letter states that the “threats must be taken seriously by Fox News,” and that “Professor Piven’s life could well be at stake.” It further asks that Mr. Ailes “order an immediate investigation into this, and insist on a speedy and fair resolution which will stop the Fox and Beck generated threats on Professor Piven.”

http://ccrjustice.org/newsroom/press-releases/update%3A-ccr-appeals-fox-news-president-help-silencing-glenn-beck-misinformat

February 9, 2011 at 10:27 p.m.
sd said...

I have to give credit where it's due. With Beck, what you see is what you get.

Limbaugh, O'Reilly, and Coulter are all pulling a fast one. They know where their bread is buttered and they change the tune as necessary.

Glenn Beck, however, strikes me as a very sincere person. He seems to genuinely believe the things he talks about on his show. He is also a very misguided person, but hey--I'm trying for the silver lining, here.

Politifact has gone easy on him, I think because there really aren't enough hours in the day to assimilate all the things his brand offers, but they do document 7 "truths" and 13 "lies." That's not a good spread for someone whose show tagline is, "A fusion of entertainment and enlightenment." But at least he lists "entertainment" first.

http://politifact.com/personalities/glenn-beck/

February 9, 2011 at 10:44 p.m.
steve_smith_tn said...

Why not a criminal investigation? If there are real death threats why would this group want Fox news to do anything. Doesn't it seem like media posturing to you? Did they really think Fox would do something? Do they really care or is the reported "outrage" enough? It seems a little disingenuous to call for a Fox investigation.

The reported blog comments are horrible. Ms. Pivens should file criminal charges if someone threatened her. Why doesn't she sue Beck for defamation? Did her second article (I haven't found it) call for or excuse violence? The article I read (from a fairly left wing source) about her article said Beck mischaracterized it as calling for violence. Is it possible he made a mistake? Alternatively, is it possible, like the hutaree, she believes violence is appropriate?

Is Ms. Pivens worthy of our consideration? Beck thought so. The Center for Constitutional Rights evidently thought so. I know more now after having had this exchange. I'll do my best to advocate for civility on blog posts. Now you guys show me something I can learn from Joy Behar or that Ed guy. Maybe Clay will do a cartoon about them tomorrow?

February 9, 2011 at 11:05 p.m.
dude_abides said...

Clay should, instead, do a cartoon on Christopher Lee. On second thought, nothing could be funnier than the real life saga. How can anyone run a winning campaign, with all that it encumbers, all the strategies, speeches, interviews, debates, etc. and still commit such a life changing, embarrassing, career ending blunder? His grandkids will see that exquisitely idiotic picture. What the hell other decisions was he capable of? He's flexing that pathetic bicep for the camera and voting on legislation on the same day? Field day for the enemies of our culture. Can't wait to read the conservative dogma he has no doubt cloaked himself in.

February 9, 2011 at 11:35 p.m.
blackwater48 said...

Mountainlaurel: nice job beating back BRP and SSTN and making your case defending Piven.

They're just right wing opinionists who forget there's a difference between fact and fiction.

Did anyone mention the time Beck called the President a Racist? I wanted to bring it up a couple of times but there was just so much material to cover and each post is limited to only 3,000 words.


Thanks, SD, for the link. I just finishing perusing Glen's file on politifact. Don't have time to go through EVERYTHING right now but I will return.

February 9, 2011 at 11:41 p.m.
SCOTTYM said...

sstn,

"Evidently, Ms. Piven wrote another more recent article that was reportedly characterized as a call to violence, a la leftist violence in Greece. I haven't been able to find it."

Bing-fu yields, http://www.thenation.com/article/157292/mobilizing-jobless

A few select quotes,

"So where are the angry crowds, the demonstrations, sit-ins and unruly mobs? After all, the injustice is apparent."

"...before people can mobilize for collective action, they have to develop a proud and angry identity and a set of claims that go with that identity."

"So, a kind of psychological transformation has to take place; the out-of-work have to stop blaming themselves for their hard times and turn their anger on the bosses, the bureaucrats or the politicians who are in fact responsible."

"...protesters need targets, preferably local and accessible ones capable of making some kind of response to angry demands."

"An effective movement of the unemployed will have to look something like the strikes and riots that have spread across Greece in response to the austerity measures forced on the Greek government by the European Union, or like the student protests that recently spread with lightning speed across England in response to the prospect of greatly increased school fees."


I guess it sucks when one's hateful rhetoric succeeds in riling up the wrong folks, eh FFP?

You and the old man had such highfalutin ideas about how to crash the U.S. system via over-burdensome entitlement spending so that it could be transformed in to a socialist worker's paradise, that you never considered that the folks you were purportedly fighting for would be the ones who suffered the most. Which is typical of course, as your type do not care about those folks, you only care about capturing the political capitol they represent.

Those death threats are your own violent, hateful rhetoric circling back on you.

Hate has a way of eating it's own. You are reaping what you have sown.

Enjoy the harvest.

February 9, 2011 at 11:46 p.m.
canarysong said...

BRP;

I'm happy to "come out of the closet" about my sources, as soon as I have time to stop what I am doing and try to remember what they were. I tried to indicate with the (?) inserted in my post that I was relying on my rather imperfect memory there.

I believe I first read about it in the Huffington Post (right, I know, that "liberal rag" as you would call it!). I then looked up clips from his show so that I could hear it "from the horse's mouth". The Feb 7th, 2011 edition of The Nation also ran an article on it.

As to your wondering if Piven is a victim "or just an old die hard socialist"........Am I missing something or do we not live in a country where we are permitted to belong to the political party of our choice, regardless of its popularity? I don't know that much about Piven, but voicing an unpopular opinion should not be grounds for threats of assassination.

Among the e-mails sent to her following Beck's rants:

"DIE YOU C**T". (asterisks mine)

"may cancer find you soon"

On Beck's website,The Blaze, commentators were even more direct with many people calling outright for her murder:

"Somebody tell Frances I have 5000 rounds ready"

"ONE SHOT...ONE KILL"

"why is this woman still alive?" Reply....."because you haven't killed her..........(someone) must actually DO SOMETHING"

.....and links to a website that listed her home address.

Neither Beck nor his editors ever stepped in to moderate the comments and attempt to tone down the rhetoric. I would hope that if comments on this forum ever began threatening or encouraging violence against anyone, including Glen Beck, that the editors of this newspaper would step in and put a stop to it.

February 10, 2011 at 12:10 a.m.
blackwater48 said...

ScottyM, thanks for the link to the Piven's article. I'll add it here, too, for convenience.

http://www.thenation.com/article/157292/mobilizing-jobless

When I read it, however, I found your edited selections misleading. You tried to paint her as a gun toting bomb tossing anarchist hell bent on revolution in America.

To me, she sounds like an old fashioned Union organizer. Not many of them around anymore.

I recommend everyone read the article for themselves. I'm going to start with the part you left out: the introduction to her article entitled, 'Mobilizing The Jobless.' By ignoring her thesis statement the rest your selected examples just twist in the wind out of context.

"MOBILIZING THE JOBLESS "As 2011 begins, nearly 15 million people are officially unemployed in the United States and another 11.5 million have either settled for part-time work or simply given up the search for a job. To regain the 5 percent unemployment level of December 2007, about 300,000 jobs would have to be created each month for several years. There are no signs that this is likely to happen soon. And joblessness now hits people harder because it follows in the wake of decades of stagnating worker earnings, high consumer indebtedness, eviscerated retirement funds and rollbacks of the social safety net.

(You started off with this next sentence and then jump to the sentence that begins 'before people can mobilize...)

"So where are the angry crowds, the demonstrations, sit-ins and unruly mobs? After all, the injustice is apparent. Working people are losing their homes and their pensions while robber-baron CEOs report renewed profits and windfall bonuses. Shouldn't the unemployed be on the march? Why aren't they demanding enhanced safety net protections and big initiatives to generate jobs?"

I didn't see the violent rhetoric your referred to. Anyway, I don't think you can blame her for some of the comments that Beck generated by lying about what the article really said. Canarysong covered some of those, but I guess it's always easier to blame the victim.

You concluded with this: "Those death threats are your own violent, hateful rhetoric circling back on you. Hate has a way of eating it's own. You are reaping what you have sown. Enjoy the harvest."

That's very well written. I don't agree with it but it's a clever turn of phrase. Thanks again for the link. I think it's possible for reasonable people to disagree, so let's leave it at that.

February 10, 2011 at 12:59 a.m.
steve_smith_tn said...

I can't really believe that of all this talk of Ms. Piven, one side only sees the evil of Beck's commenters and the other side only the evil of her Machiavellian calculations.

I recognize both. Which is the most important and thought provoking to discuss? The cure for bad speech is more speech. People don't need to be "moderated." They need to be exposed. These idiot commenters were exposed. This "Professor" who has likely shaped the minds of young adults has been exposed. Isn't both of those things healthy?

Should you folks be "moderated?" Should I? Does no one think the more important discussion should be about the absolute failure of the war on poverty. Like every other social "war," it was/is a failure. Evidently Beck is not. We are all still talking about him and the Ms. Piven he brought to us.

But Oh I forgot, he's just crazy and hateful and probably doesn't recycle.

February 10, 2011 at 1:02 a.m.
Clara said...

ScottyM, I don't think you are capable of reading things correctly if they don't meet your viewpoint. Asking for a protest gathering is not inciting to riot. Gathering to ask for help correct a wrong as a group is not a reason to turn on the hate. Did you actually read the Beck's paragraphs from the interview that mtnl suggested? Rantiing as the cartoon suggests. Mental!!!

You're the one inciting the mayhem!

February 10, 2011 at 2:02 a.m.
delmar said...

BPR - "It occurred to me that I could use a similar sentiment towards the progressives here, but I am pretty sure I will be back to continue to bestow you all with just a sliver of the kind of thinking that made David Crocket such a great man."

Good grief, are you really comparing yourself to Davy Crockett? I'll bet you and your ego fill up a room pretty fast.

I knew Davy Crockett, and you sir, are no Davy Crockett!

February 10, 2011 at 11:16 a.m.
dunkziy said...

Well, I don't watch his TV show, but I've seen and heard enough of his rants from others who like to share them and I don't agree with them.

On the subject of his faith, I share the same, Mormon. But I still think Glenn is a nutcase, and from what I've seen I don't see him as a good example of a typical Mormon, many of his comments are personal and insulting and are thus un-Christlike. I hope he is learning more about the Lord and the Plan of Salvation. Faith is, of course, a personal issue as is the relationship with our Heavenly Father.

I don't know if Glenn is pushing it through his media output but from what I've read just on this forum, it appears not to be the case.

From what little I have seen of him He's appears to be more of a showman than a considered politician.. but then again, who would trust any politician, Left, Right, Red or Blue?

February 10, 2011 at 1:04 p.m.

Why would I waste my time listening to Beck? He gets paid to stir up the pot. Don't care who or what he is or how he got to where he is. He's not a viable source of valid information in my opinion.

February 10, 2011 at 3:29 p.m.
SCOTTYM said...

bw48,

"You tried to paint her as a gun toting bomb tossing anarchist hell bent on revolution in America."

Really? Can you point to ANYTHING I wrote about bombs or guns in relation to FFP?

Of course not.

She's looking for angry mobs, and violent protests in order to secure political power for her socialist friends. I pointed that out.

Notice also that I posted "Select quotes".

Funny that when you post "select quotes" it seems to be OK, but when I do it I'm being misleading.

Hmmm.

The leftist double standard in full effect.

Francis Fox Piven is the scum of the Earth and I would not shed a single tear if someone did turn her head into a canoe. Hell, I might throw a party.

February 10, 2011 at 5:05 p.m.
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