conservative said...I do thank you for not even attempting to refute anything I wrote to you yesterday.
You are assuming that most of what you wrote yesterday was worth reading. I do not share that assumption and I din't read most of it.
I am not sure what you mean by "Scripture is very clear about the distinction between sin, which God hates and sinners, whom God loves" because one cannot separate sin from the sinner. Sin is not an inanimate object like a rock with no awareness of God and his requirements.
conservative said...I constantly marvel at your intransigence in refusing to believe the word of God on the sin of homosexuality...
I am not sure what you mean by "Scripture is very clear about the distinction between sin, which God hates and sinners, whom God loves" because one cannot separate sin from the sinner.
The operative word is GRACE.
You insist on taking that one passage in Romans 2 regarding homosexuality out of context. I read Romans 1 - 3 as a unit. The list of sins in those chapters, although probably not complete, is pretty comprehensive. It is sufficient to condemn everyone - you included. But, the story doesn't end with God's hatred for sins. The list of sins is bookended with two promises - the passages that I posted above. God judges us on the basis of the promises (His love for sinners), not on the basis of our sins.
You keep insisting that God hates homosexuals because God hates homosexuality. If that is the way that you want God to judge the homosexual, that might well be the way that you will also be judged. If God's grace is not sufficient for the homosexual, it probably is not sufficient for you either.
Instead of putting your confidence in your own ability to know the mind of God and, acting on His behalf, to judge others, put your trust in the promise.
conservative said...I am delighted that you chose to quote Romans Chapter 2 for it most surely condemns homosexuality.
So what? Scripture is very clear about the distinction between sin, which God hates and sinners, whom God loves. Romans chapter 2 is bracketed by words of promise. If, in your judgement, those words of promise are not for the homosexual, you are also judging that you aren't worthy of the promise, either.
For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, to the Jew ffirst and also to gthe Greek. For in it hthe righteousness of God is revealed ifrom faith for faith,as it is written, “The righteous shall live by faith.”
But now the righteousness of God has been manifested apart from the law, although the Law and the Prophets bear witness to it—the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction: for fall have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.
conservative said...EVERY practicing homosexual will spend eternity in hell...
Conservative - even if your rigid and unloving interpretation of Scripture, it is not your place to judge.
Therefore you have no excuse, O man, every one of you who judges. For in passing judgment on another you condemn yourself, because you, the judge, practice the very same things. We know that the judgment of God rightly falls on those who practice such things. Do you suppose, O man—you who judge those who practice such things and yet do them yourself—that you will escape the judgment of God? Or do you presume on the riches of his kindness and forbearance and patience, not knowing that God's kindness is meant to lead you to repentance? But because of your hard and impenitent heart you are storing up wrath for yourself on the day of wrath when God's righteous judgment will be revealed.
Jt6gR3hM said...MTJohn it is very odd that you have no comment on the religious content of the posts from nucanuck, alprova, mountainlaurel, Donald, delmar, or MickeyRat.
Jt6 - please explain how I could comment on the religious content of posts that did not contain religious content.
conservative said...Disciples/followers of Jesus Christ are called Christians, that is the origin of the name. Where in the Bible, where the doctrines of Christianity are taught and the only place they are taught, do you find Jesus teaching his followers hatred for others and violence toward others for their beliefs?
Conservative - we are only a couple of weeks past the remembrance of the resurrection and, a few days prior to that, the remembrance of Jesus establishing with us a new covenant - a covenant based in two commandments: 1) love God and 2) love your neighbor as yourself. That doctrine is clearly taught in Scripture. The difficulty is that too many folk who call themselves Christian - Fred Phelps being one example - behave as though they had never heard of the new covenant.
conservative said...First I ask that you to definitely state whether homosexuality is sinful behavior or not. I suspect that you don't believe it is sinful behavior and that you will refuse to state so.
I'll ask one more time and then let you have the last word.
What part of grace don't you understand?
Of course the homosexual is a sinner. But, then, so are you and I. But, especially on this morning, we are reminded that we no longer live under the Law but with the promise of forgiveness and salvation.
Does the homosexual deserve that promise? No. Do you deserve that promise? No. Will the homosexual receive that promise because he stops sinning? No. Will you receive that promise because you have stopped sinning. If the homosexual receives that promise will he stop sinning? No. If you receive that promise will you stop sinning? No.
But, thanks be to God who has given us the victory in Christ Jesus. He is risen indeed! Alleluia!
conservative said...You quoted Scripture about the lost condition of mankind apart from Jesus Christ. I believe every word. Now, what do those verses have to do with the fact that a practicing homosexual will not inherit the Kingdom of God?
as it is written: "There is no one who is righteous, not even one; there is no one who has understanding, there is no one who seeks God. All have turned aside, together they have become worthless; there is no one who shows kindness, there is not even one." Romans 3:10-12
No one includes you and me, Conservative.
The passages that you and I cited are bracketed by the following:
For I am not ashamed of the gospel; it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who has faith, to the Jew first and also to the Greek. 17 For in it the righteousness of God is revealed through faith for faith; as it is written, "The one who is righteous will live by faith." Romans 1:16-17
and
the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction,since all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God; they are now justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus...
Romans 3:22-24
The promise isn't just for you and me. The promise is offered to everyone, including folks whom you think are not worthy to receive it. That is the promise that we remember this weekend. If it isn't for "them", it isn't for you either.
Birth Control
JonRoss said...You lefty obastards...
JonRoss - is this how you set an example of Christian charity and tolerance?
The MVP
conservative said...I do thank you for not even attempting to refute anything I wrote to you yesterday.
You are assuming that most of what you wrote yesterday was worth reading. I do not share that assumption and I din't read most of it.
I am not sure what you mean by "Scripture is very clear about the distinction between sin, which God hates and sinners, whom God loves" because one cannot separate sin from the sinner. Sin is not an inanimate object like a rock with no awareness of God and his requirements.
conservative said...I constantly marvel at your intransigence in refusing to believe the word of God on the sin of homosexuality... I am not sure what you mean by "Scripture is very clear about the distinction between sin, which God hates and sinners, whom God loves" because one cannot separate sin from the sinner.
The operative word is GRACE.
You insist on taking that one passage in Romans 2 regarding homosexuality out of context. I read Romans 1 - 3 as a unit. The list of sins in those chapters, although probably not complete, is pretty comprehensive. It is sufficient to condemn everyone - you included. But, the story doesn't end with God's hatred for sins. The list of sins is bookended with two promises - the passages that I posted above. God judges us on the basis of the promises (His love for sinners), not on the basis of our sins.
You keep insisting that God hates homosexuals because God hates homosexuality. If that is the way that you want God to judge the homosexual, that might well be the way that you will also be judged. If God's grace is not sufficient for the homosexual, it probably is not sufficient for you either.
Instead of putting your confidence in your own ability to know the mind of God and, acting on His behalf, to judge others, put your trust in the promise.
The MVP
conservative said...I am delighted that you chose to quote Romans Chapter 2 for it most surely condemns homosexuality.
So what? Scripture is very clear about the distinction between sin, which God hates and sinners, whom God loves. Romans chapter 2 is bracketed by words of promise. If, in your judgement, those words of promise are not for the homosexual, you are also judging that you aren't worthy of the promise, either.
For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, to the Jew ffirst and also to gthe Greek. For in it hthe righteousness of God is revealed ifrom faith for faith,as it is written, “The righteous shall live by faith.”
But now the righteousness of God has been manifested apart from the law, although the Law and the Prophets bear witness to it—the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction: for fall have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.
The MVP
conservative said...EVERY practicing homosexual will spend eternity in hell...
Conservative - even if your rigid and unloving interpretation of Scripture, it is not your place to judge.
Therefore you have no excuse, O man, every one of you who judges. For in passing judgment on another you condemn yourself, because you, the judge, practice the very same things. We know that the judgment of God rightly falls on those who practice such things. Do you suppose, O man—you who judge those who practice such things and yet do them yourself—that you will escape the judgment of God? Or do you presume on the riches of his kindness and forbearance and patience, not knowing that God's kindness is meant to lead you to repentance? But because of your hard and impenitent heart you are storing up wrath for yourself on the day of wrath when God's righteous judgment will be revealed.
Marathon Bombers
Jt6gR3hM said...MTJohn it is very odd that you have no comment on the religious content of the posts from nucanuck, alprova, mountainlaurel, Donald, delmar, or MickeyRat.
Jt6 - please explain how I could comment on the religious content of posts that did not contain religious content.
Marathon Bombers
conservative said...Disciples/followers of Jesus Christ are called Christians, that is the origin of the name. Where in the Bible, where the doctrines of Christianity are taught and the only place they are taught, do you find Jesus teaching his followers hatred for others and violence toward others for their beliefs?
Conservative - we are only a couple of weeks past the remembrance of the resurrection and, a few days prior to that, the remembrance of Jesus establishing with us a new covenant - a covenant based in two commandments: 1) love God and 2) love your neighbor as yourself. That doctrine is clearly taught in Scripture. The difficulty is that too many folk who call themselves Christian - Fred Phelps being one example - behave as though they had never heard of the new covenant.
No Sooner Said
conservative said...First I ask that you to definitely state whether homosexuality is sinful behavior or not. I suspect that you don't believe it is sinful behavior and that you will refuse to state so.
I'll ask one more time and then let you have the last word.
What part of grace don't you understand?
Of course the homosexual is a sinner. But, then, so are you and I. But, especially on this morning, we are reminded that we no longer live under the Law but with the promise of forgiveness and salvation.
Does the homosexual deserve that promise? No. Do you deserve that promise? No. Will the homosexual receive that promise because he stops sinning? No. Will you receive that promise because you have stopped sinning. If the homosexual receives that promise will he stop sinning? No. If you receive that promise will you stop sinning? No.
But, thanks be to God who has given us the victory in Christ Jesus. He is risen indeed! Alleluia!
No Sooner Said
conservative said...You quoted Scripture about the lost condition of mankind apart from Jesus Christ. I believe every word. Now, what do those verses have to do with the fact that a practicing homosexual will not inherit the Kingdom of God?
What part of grace do you not comprehend?
No Sooner Said
Conservative - think context!
as it is written: "There is no one who is righteous, not even one; there is no one who has understanding, there is no one who seeks God. All have turned aside, together they have become worthless; there is no one who shows kindness, there is not even one." Romans 3:10-12
No one includes you and me, Conservative.
The passages that you and I cited are bracketed by the following:
For I am not ashamed of the gospel; it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who has faith, to the Jew first and also to the Greek. 17 For in it the righteousness of God is revealed through faith for faith; as it is written, "The one who is righteous will live by faith." Romans 1:16-17
and
the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction,since all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God; they are now justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus... Romans 3:22-24
The promise isn't just for you and me. The promise is offered to everyone, including folks whom you think are not worthy to receive it. That is the promise that we remember this weekend. If it isn't for "them", it isn't for you either.
No Sooner Said
EaTn said...Who are the wicked? God searches the hearts and minds of all. I and all the others on this site stand naked before Him.
I agree and no more apparent than in the commemoration that some of us may have participated in yesterday.