published Thursday, November 10th, 2011

Maternity Wear

about Clay Bennett...

The son of a career army officer, Bennett led a nomadic life, attending ten different schools before graduating in 1980 from the University of North Alabama with degrees in Art and History. After brief stints as a staff artist at the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette and the Fayetteville (NC) Times, he went on to serve as the editorial cartoonist for the St. Petersburg Times (1981-1994) and The Christian Science Monitor (1997-2007), before joining the staff of the ...

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onetinsoldier said...

Good timing Clay, Mississippi just declared sanity. How would you like it for women to be charged as murderers for wearing IUDs or using spermicide? Repugnants have pushed their idiocy about as far as the American people will tolerate.

November 10, 2011 at 12:18 a.m.
nucanuck said...

Amazing how much higher the percentage of men over women oppose choice. What does that tell us?

November 10, 2011 at 1:06 a.m.
egeltje said...

Also interesting: People who are pro-life are often pro-death penalty. People who are pro-choice are often anti-death penalty. Either way, they terminate life.

November 10, 2011 at 1:51 a.m.
fairmon said...

Those making the choice should pay the cost. Those that can't afford to pay and opt for me(tax payer) to pay should be required to include sterilization if the pregnancy results from consensual sex.

I support the death penalty in cases where there is "no doubt". I support a penal system that requires those incarcerated to pay the cost of their incarceration by growing their own food and doing other productive work without abuse and misuse by prison personnel.

November 10, 2011 at 3:12 a.m.
fairmon said...

The pro choice issue will pale as this administration and congress lead us closer to bankruptcy. The reduced social security taxes has now put that program in the red much sooner than projected.Social security should not be part of the general fund thanks to LBJ as a way to make the general fund look better and give congress access to it for his guns and butter great society spending. No president or congress has addressed that issue but blame the debt and the woes of the economy on these programs instead of acknowledging their out of control spending.

November 10, 2011 at 3:23 a.m.
Rickaroo said...

"Also interesting: People who are pro-life are often pro-death penalty. People who are pro-choice are often anti-death penalty. Either way, they terminate life." - egeltje

I think the reason for that is because most hard-core anti-abortionists are fundamentalist Christians, or people who are greatly influenced by them, and they look at the world through the lens of the Old Testament. They don't believe in mercy and compassion as much as they do punishment for the sinners. They especially hate pre-marital sex and so many women today are getting pregnant outside of marriage. To deny them access to abortion under any and all circumstances is as much a punishment for the "sinners" as it is compassion, or so-called compassion, for the unborn. They don't give a rat's ass about the unborn, they just want to flaunt their gd sanctimoniousness and police the morals of everyone else.

Of course, there is absolutely nothing in the OT, or the New Testament, for that matter, that addresses abortion specifically, but most of the bible thumpers can find some obscure verse somewhere that they think reveals God's condemnation of it. They're masters at cherry-picking the things that give them an excuse to hate and to judge those who do not share their primitive world view.

No matter whether the life inside a pregnant woman is a zygote, an embryo, or a fetus, it is still a POTENTIAL life, and the life of the woman, who is a fully formed, fully functioning human being should in all cases take precedence over the POTENTIAL life that she is carrying. That seed of life within her should be respected, nurtured, and loved as much as possible for the potential life that it is, but to give it such importance that the mother carrying it is reduced to nothing, no importance whatsoever in relationship to it, is complete lunacy.

In any case, what a woman does with her own body should be left up to HER and her doctor and her God or conscience and NOBODY has any business telling her what she can or cannot do for her own reproductive health and wellbeing.

November 10, 2011 at 3:39 a.m.
AndrewLohr said...

The murder of little babies is evil.

November 10, 2011 at 5:46 a.m.
dougmusn said...

I remain puzzled about this: why are uber-conservatives often rabidly 'pro-life', seeking a harsh governmental presence in as intrusive and personal venue as can exist, while they inveigh against the perils of big government in every other area? Do they just seek to drown women in that bathtub along with government reduced to near-extinction?

November 10, 2011 at 5:47 a.m.
AndrewLohr said...

Even a limited government should punish murder, doug.

As a reporter (?), maybe Mr Bennett should visit AAA Women's Services (do they call it "Choices" now?) to check out whether they care about women in difficulties and about born babies, and even about the men who got the women in trouble, not just about unborn babies.

We know what "pro-life" means in this context, but "pro-justice" might be more precise. Babies are innocent: let them live. Murderers and rapists are guilty: let them be executed.

November 10, 2011 at 6:01 a.m.
woody said...

I sincerely hope 'the future' will note that Mississippians showed the rest of us just how assinine it is to even contemplate wanting to control another person's body, or the decisions thereof.

"Choice" is what separates us from all other forms of life..take "Choice" away, and what is left is not much of a life..Woody

November 10, 2011 at 6:31 a.m.
EaTn said...

Ever hear anyone say they remember you when you were just a gleam in your daddy's eye? Does a person begin at gleam, conception or birth? Does preventing choice then allow the child or elderly to suffer, humane? Everyone has their opinion but those who have to live with their conscience should have the final vote.

November 10, 2011 at 6:41 a.m.
MTJohn said...

AndrewLohr said...

The murder of little babies is evil.

Giving birth to an unwanted pregnancy is evil.

Insisting that women give birth to unwanted pregnancies, while also supporting the denial of social services for the mother and child also is evil.

Humans do lots of evil things, Andrew. Why focus on just one or two specific sins? If you are going to be zealous about one sin, why aren't the "pro-life" folks as zealous about every other sin? Two specific sins are, in my opinion, due comparable attention - greed and falsehoods. Yet, those two sins not only get a pass but often are celebrated by the party of "family values".

Rickaroo said...I think the reason for that is because most hard-core anti-abortionists are fundamentalist Christians, or people who are greatly influenced by them, and they look at the world through the lens of the Old Testament.

That sounds like an oxymoron to me. I would think that folks who refer to themselves as Christians would look at the world through the lens of the Cross, passages like John 3:16 and Romans 5:8, and the message that God is Love.

November 10, 2011 at 7:28 a.m.
alprova said...

Harp3339 wrote: "Those making the choice should pay the cost. Those that can't afford to pay and opt for me(tax payer) to pay should be required to include sterilization if the pregnancy results from consensual sex."

What a ludicrous proposition. Are you presenting yourself as a person who has never made a mistake at anytime in your life? If, and I do mean if, any of the taxes that you have paid was ever used on behalf of someone who chose to end a pregnancy, I seriously doubt that more than a penny was taken from your pocket.

Do you think it's fair to maim someone for life, never to allow them to procreate at some future point in their life, over a penny?

November 10, 2011 at 7:30 a.m.
ibshame said...

Why is that people who claim to be against goverment intrusions and government regulations want to impose their views on a woman through government intrusions and regulations?

November 10, 2011 at 7:31 a.m.
patriot1 said...

Democrats/Liberals claim to about pro-choice but when you look at their social programs it's anything but:

Social Security - nmandatory Medicare - mandatory Obamacare - mandaroty

What happened to the choice?

November 10, 2011 at 7:46 a.m.
mystyre said...

AndrewLohr said..."We know what "pro-life" means in this context, but "pro-justice" might be more precise. Babies are innocent: let them live. Murderers and rapists are guilty: let them be executed"

under this context, how many women you think will have consentual intercourse then, claim they were raped in order to obtain an abortion. now you will have a new set of injustice to handle.

November 10, 2011 at 7:53 a.m.
macropetala8 said...

mystyre said... AndrewLohr said..."We know what "pro-life" means in this context, but "pro-justice" might be more precise. Babies are innocent: let them live. Murderers and rapists are guilty: let them be executed" under this context, how many women you think will have consentual intercourse then, claim they were raped in order to obtain an abortion. now you will have a new set of injustice to handle

Bet no one ever considered that reality. :?

November 10, 2011 at 9:08 a.m.

I agree with this cartoon. If you think the police don't have jurisdiction over your body, go up to one and tell him/her seriously that you are going to kill yourself. You will see who has "jurisdiction" very shortly after that.

November 10, 2011 at 9:24 a.m.

Riddle me this. If someone kills a pregnant woman, does that person get charged just for the murder of the woman or do they throw in charges for the killing of the baby as well?

November 10, 2011 at 9:29 a.m.
jayhay182 said...

Everybody is always screaming the same thing, "IT'S MY BODY, IT'S MY BODY, I'LL DO WHAT I WANT!" I do agree it is your body and you should be able to whatever you want with it. Want to get a tatoo? Go ahead. Want to do drugs? You've been told about what it does to you but be my guest. Want to smoke cigarettes? Good luck trying to breathe normally after years of that. Want to get sloppy drunk? Just hope no pictures of you show up on the internet tomorrow. Don't want to wear a seatbelt or helmet when riding a motorcycle? You will be the only one splattered on the ground if you hit a tree. Some of these things are legal like getting a tatoo or smoking and the other things like not wearing a helmet or a seatbelt I feel should not be against the law. Because you really are not hurting anybody else but yourself. But when your body is taking care of another life then you should at least respect it enough to give it a chance. If you don't want the baby then just carry it to full term and give it up for adoption. I don't think there should be a law against abortions but the woman carrying it should at least think about other options. I know there are certain situations like rape or incest or carrying to full term would endanger the mothers life and I feel those tough decisions need to be up to the mother, not the state or the government. It's when there is nothing wrong with the baby or the mother and they just are to selfish to care for the child and just don't want to put up with it that gets me. You could start the whole debate about when life starts. But most scientists would say that life can take all kinds of forms. Bacterial life is life even though it doesn't have a heart like yours or mine. If we discovered bacteria on Mars then that would be life on another planet. So believe what you will and do what you want with your body but just be respectful of another potential life. Somebody was respectful enough to bring you into this world.

November 10, 2011 at 9:34 a.m.
MTJohn said...

FlyingPurpleSheepleEater said...

Riddle me this. If someone kills a pregnant woman, does that person get charged just for the murder of the woman or do they throw in charges for the killing of the baby as well?

If these are capital offenses, please explain how you intend to hang the perp twice.

November 10, 2011 at 9:35 a.m.

MTJohn, Beats me. I don't understand the whole multiple life sentences either. If you don't want them to ever get out, just deny them parole. If someone gets a death sentence, let them have 2 appeals then get it over with.

The real question is, how can anyone be charged with murder for killing an unborn child if it is just a choice? It happens all the time. Why?

November 10, 2011 at 9:42 a.m.
MTJohn said...

jayhay182 said... I don't think there should be a law against abortions but the woman carrying it should at least think about other options.

What is your basis for concluding that most women who have abortions to terminate unwanted pregnancies have not first considered all options prior to making their decision?

November 10, 2011 at 9:42 a.m.
mtngrl said...

"The real question is, how can anyone be charged with murder for killing an unborn child if it is just a choice? "

The choice belongs to the one with the womb, not the murderer of the one with the womb.

November 10, 2011 at 10:09 a.m.
potcat said...

Harp ,

I can assure you that people in Prison ( its a big Secret... shhh) are getting Plenty of work. That is work i.e. JOBs taken from Men and Women of our area. Want to know where they are going to?

My Son Works as a Supervisor at a S.C. Prison for Men who are doing long Sentences and some will never get out. They have built a Factory at the Prison and make every kind of Flooring you can imagine. and my Son Supervises thes Men.

Of course the Prisoners get a wage, but nothing like a Company would have to pay a Civilian.

It all came from Dalton GA. and his Checks are from Chattanooga, I am assuming thats the way the Carpet Business is going. The Reporter on this subject is a little to buddy buds with these Business Guys to REALLY tell it like it is.

Its the Truth, i can prove it. Every one in the S.C. area knows it and so do these Dalton Guys.Don't believe the ,oh people just are not buying. they are getting CHEAPER LABOR from THe Prison System.

November 10, 2011 at 10:10 a.m.
JustOneWoman said...

Generally speaking, men do not want to talk about periods, tampons, cramps, etc. But when someone has convinced them that a fertilized egg is a person, watch out. They will crow about a subject they know nothing about. All that will change when they show them that sperm is living as well. If this war on women continues, kiss your viagra goodbye and watch out for the masterbation police. This war will go both ways. And for now, we are the keeper of the eggs. If you want to use your religion as the reason to say a fertilized egg is life, and that abortion or birth control is murder, better go read your bible.
I am curious. Since a fertilized egg only has a 50% chance of attaching to the uterus, is it murder when the egg discharges or when it doesn't connect, or when it dies? If sperm is alive when it leaves the male body, but dies in the woman's body, is it murder by the woman for accepting the dying cells or by the man because he aborted them?

November 10, 2011 at 10:15 a.m.

mtngrl, so it is the wombholder that magically transforms it from murder to a choice when getting an abortion?
Either it is a life or it isn't. It is a double standard to call it a life when a murderer kills a pregnant woman and calling it a choice when the woman chooses to kill the baby. It doesn't make any sense at all.

November 10, 2011 at 10:17 a.m.

JOW, If you live to age 50 and then die suddenly from a fall in the bathtub, did the bathtub kill you? What if you die peacefully in your sleep? Was sleep your murderer?
When life dies on it's own, it is natural. When someone purposefully ends it because it is convenient for them to do so, it is murder. Men can't get away with an assualt charge if they punch a woman in the abdomen until her unborn child dies. Women shouldn't be able to get away scott free for killing the child either. Either it is a baby or it isn't. Which is it?

November 10, 2011 at 10:29 a.m.
onetinsoldier said...

It isn't life til it draws its first breath. It's dead when it draws its last.

November 10, 2011 at 10:31 a.m.
potcat said...

Misssissippi... the poorest , highest School drop out rate in the the Country,12 yr. olds having babies is not unusual and its a Republican State, enough said!!! They go against their own Economic interest at the Polls , like they do in TN.

Have any of you read the book,(Whats The Matter with Kansas). just take Kansas out and put Mississippi in, that should tell you what you are dealing with.

November 10, 2011 at 10:33 a.m.
JustOneWoman said...

Potcat, you are exactly right. The more these idiots can make criminal, the more free labor they have to "outsource". And one doesn't have to look very far to see the proof. Georgia set up the farm labor shortage, then proceeded to outsource their prison labor to cover it.

November 10, 2011 at 10:37 a.m.
mtngrl said...

"Either it is a life or it isn't."

It is potential life, not life on its own. Like onetinsoldier states it is life when it draws its first breath. Until then it is part of the women's body. If that woman has been planning for this child to come into the world and that is taken away from her against her will that would defiantly be a crime, but not up to me whether is is officially called murder or not. I personally do not see it should be called that but the crime should carry the same weight.

The main confusion many seem to have is believing life begins at some definable point. It is not a point but a process. It takes approximately 9 months for the process to complete.

You can argue till you are blue in the face on the esoteric nature of when life begins, but it currently legally begins at that first breath. That is why every age related legal issue is based on your birth date, not conception date. Would the passage of that law in Mississippi have suddenly caused everyone in that state to become 9 months older? Every resident would be able to drive, drink, join the military, be eligible for social security, etc. 9 months earlier?

November 10, 2011 at 10:46 a.m.
righteous said...

The truth is, we should not waste the aborted baibes, they are a good source of stem cells and protein. There are too many people on the planet already. We should take all the unemployed women (voluntarily of course) and set up baby farms and use this precious resource to solve hunger/medical problems for the living. Just my opinion.

November 10, 2011 at 10:50 a.m.
chet123 said...

PATRIOT11....Those program such as Social Security - Medicare - Obamacare preserve real human lives...thats as pro-life as it get....PATRIOT11,why are you in odds?......You got to be republican to make such an idiotic Argument......maybe men sperm should be consider life hmmmmmmmmm....guarantee you this argument would fade away(these are men who are controllers) ha ha....

When men start having baby...then they can be objective as a pro-lifer.....i would love to see Rush limbaugh pregnant...ha ha

November 10, 2011 at 10:58 a.m.

Mtngrl, The only penalty would be an assault charge. If it isn't life, it doesn't count towards any charges. Are you suggesting some kind of theft or vandalism charge?

November 10, 2011 at 11:09 a.m.
chet123 said...

I love to hear from these Pseudo Pro-Lifer(republicans)....Where were they at doing TROY DAVIS execution(the wrong man was executed)...or the thousand of lives lost doing bush pre-emptive strike to get Saudi Hussein...children, women, and thousand of innocent men...that had nothing to do with 911..Hmmmm where were the Pro-Lifer Hmmmmmm...As posted above, the republicans are against Social Security,Medicare,Obamacare....THEY SAY LET THEM DIE!!!! Now they want to control women body...WHAT GALLS!

You have to love these nuts in the Republican Party....Obama have run them crazy ha ha ha...

Notice how they never or sparingly use the word Democrats...its always liberals, liberals,liberal ha ha ha they do that to degenerate the democrats(a page from LEE ATWATER)..ha ha....i refer to them as republicans or tea party(who is only goldwater republican) ha ha

November 10, 2011 at 11:22 a.m.
conservative said...

Some may look at this recognition by a lieberal that the woman is carrying a BABY as a sign of moral progress. NOT SO, it is a further step in moral depravity, in that he is opposed to legal protection of the BABY!

November 10, 2011 at 11:39 a.m.
chet123 said...

FLYINGPURPLESHEEPLEEATER.....WHY DO YOU REPUBLICAN NUTS ALWAYS CHOOSE SUCH LONG LETTER WORDS.....MAYBE YOU HOPE NOONE WANT TO TAKE THE TIME TO RESPOND...SO YOU GET A FREE PASS!!!See you are an expert on the woman body....I notice people like you usually have no children.....maybe you need to start pro-creating first. And your argument above make no sense good buddy!

The bathtub theory make by as much sense as you do ha ha.... you miss the point....because you dont want to hear the truth....republican like you will just mindless GOOSE-STEP off a clift..You love to pick losing issues.....by the way....tell your buddy to be consistenton the pro-life issue

November 10, 2011 at 11:46 a.m.
MickeyRat said...

The day anti-choice fanatics also support social programs that give unwanted children the tools to succeed in life is the day I stop holding religious fanatics in contempt. Well...maybe not. They will still have a ways to go in terms of civil rights for non-believers, or the other hypocritical nonsense they espouse daily.

All ‘Right to Life’ fanatics are energized. It is their prerequisite for zealotry. If not kept in check, these zealots will convolute the meaning of ‘The right to life’ into, 'The right to life gives a woman the right to not have intercourse with a man'. Welcome to the dark ages.

I wish more religious conservatives believed in birth control....for the sake of the rest of us.

November 10, 2011 at 11:51 a.m.
chet123 said...

There goes conservative...on the soap box preaching morality ha ha ha what a joke!....conservative the only moral you beleive in is the green...you have more holes in your so-call morality than a slice of swiss-cheese....please dont try to school folks on morality...If you want to talk about morals....take your sorrow butt to the finacial institution and condem them on usury.....be consistent! These loan company all over the country that lend money at rates as high as 80%annual rate....hmmmmm...have never heard of a republican tackling the finacial systems hmmmm i wander why??? PLUCK, PLUCK, PLUCK, PLUCKKKKKK! mAYBE JUST MAYBE CHICKEN.....

iF YOU WANT TO TALK MORAL..READ THE OLD TESTEMENT BIBLE AND SEE WHAT THE BIBLE SAY ABOUT USURY....THE WORD IS USURY....GOD DESTROYED NATIONS BECAUSE OF USURY AND GREED HMMMM...tell your phony preachers to preach on greed sometime...or the 4 gospels or the book of amos in the old testement.....be consistent fool!!!! then you may have a leg to stand on....but dont cherry pick out of the bible.....just your pet pea..to put down the women..and ignore your SINS!.....This why i could never,never,never be a republican...you are not real men!

November 10, 2011 at 12:02 p.m.
chet123 said...

Hello Mickeyrat....can you beleive these right-wing nuts?....i'm leaving right now ..i will be back to respond to their posting

November 10, 2011 at 12:11 p.m.
jayhay182 said...

@MTJohn, if a woman has an unwanted pregnancy and it was not because of rape or incest or there is no problem with the baby that would put the mothers life in danger then there should not be any problem with her carrying to full term and giving the baby up for adoption. There are agencies out there that would pay for this and couples that cannot have kids that would help out financially as well. My basis is a girl I knew from high school who had lots of unprotected sex and she told her partners she was allergic to latex so they could not wear condoms. So of course she would get pregnant and then just go and have it terminated. That is very irresponsible. And purple sheeple also made a very good point as well. If a pregnant woman is killed and the baby she is carrying dies then the murderer would face 2 murder charges. But if the mother was going to go get an abortion on that same day it would have been ok and the baby would not have been recognized as a person. So let me rephrase my original quote. I do think that the courts need to decide on what is considered murder of a baby or fetus. If the person who murdered the mother and the baby dies will be punished for his crime then why is the mother getting off scott free? Then that brings us back to the whole "it's my body" debate. Yes, your body but there is another body inside of you.

November 10, 2011 at 12:18 p.m.
rolando said...

"Like onetinsoldier states it is life when it draws its first breath."

And yet those abortion doctors who let babies who survived their botched abortions die in closets, etc are never tried for murder of a living being, MtnGirl. The wee babes usually from neglect...but certainly from lack of love.

They are [or were] living, breathing babies...yet the doctors murdered them just as surely as if they had used a gun instead of a knife/scissors.

So your statement [and tinman's] isn't a universal definition of when life begins anymore than Mississippi's is.

Personally, I think it begins at the point when the baby can survive outside the mother's body. Yes, another most inexact definition but probably closer to truth than yours or Mississippi's.

November 10, 2011 at 12:43 p.m.
lkeithlu said...

Personally, I think it begins at the point when the baby can survive outside the mother's body. Yes, another most inexact definition but probably closer to truth than yours or Mississippi's.

I agree with rolando. Life begins at viability. Unless the mother is in danger, abortions should happen before that time. But I think we should make abortions rare, through education, birth control, women's health services. That doesn't mean people won't be irresponsible, or that rapes won't occur, or birth control will always work. But the women most in need of abortions are the ones least able to raise a child: drug or alcohol addicted, mentally challenged, very poor, underage. Will others abuse it? Of course.

November 10, 2011 at 1:11 p.m.
LibDem said...

jayhay182 , An excellent solution. Carry to full term and put the baby up for adoption. There's not a Christian man out there who wouldn't be delighted to give up smoking and drinking and carry a fetus in his body for nine months.

November 10, 2011 at 1:28 p.m.
lumpy said...

Wrong, egeltje, many who are ok with abortion are against the death penalty.

November 10, 2011 at 1:35 p.m.

Excellent point LibDem! Why should they have to be inconvenienced or take responsibility for their actions?

November 10, 2011 at 1:54 p.m.
MTJohn said...

jayhay182 said...@MTJohn, if a woman has an unwanted pregnancy and it was not because of rape or incest or there is no problem with the baby that would put the mothers life in danger then there should not be any problem with her carrying to full term and giving the baby up for adoption.

That's easy enough for you to say, especially if you are male.

The reality is that life often is a multiple choice test in which all of the answers are wrong. In those situations, I think it is incorrect for you to impose you "right" wrong answer to a circumstance that you might not have to experience that issue on someone else who is trying to work through it.

November 10, 2011 at 2:37 p.m.

The premise that men can't understand the difficulties inherent to pregnancy because we aren't female is sexism. It's like saying female doctors shouldn't treat male patients becuase they don't have the same plumbing.

November 10, 2011 at 2:59 p.m.
MTJohn said...

Ok,fpse. Since you obviously understand it, please explain difficult pregnancy.

November 10, 2011 at 3:01 p.m.

Thanks MTJ, I fixed it.

November 10, 2011 at 3:09 p.m.
MTJohn said...

OK, fpse. Since you obviously understand them, please explain the difficulties inherent in pregnancy.

November 10, 2011 at 4:09 p.m.
fairmon said...

Potcat..

Re. Prison labor. That is the abuse and misuse I was talking about. The prisoners should be paid any revenue above the cost of operating and maintaining the facility. No private entity should profit from the process. It should be highly regulated and monitored to assure proper use of funds and distribution of revenue. Regulations should include product pricing at no less than the mid level of private producers.

November 10, 2011 at 4:39 p.m.
fairmon said...

Alprova said....

Are you presenting yourself as a person who has never made a mistake at anytime in your life? If, and I do mean if, any of the taxes that you have paid was ever used on behalf of someone who chose to end a pregnancy, I seriously doubt that more than a penny was taken from your pocket.

Do you think it's fair to maim someone for life, never to allow them to procreate at some future point in their life, over a penny?

Choices we make have consequences either good or bad. Bad choices have bad consequences which most people have experienced. It is not just the money but the abuse of the system that needs to stop. I see nothing wrong with those not able to pay for their own abortion not being able to procreate since they are not likely able to support a child. Proliferation of a dependent society is not in the best interest of anyone.

November 10, 2011 at 4:47 p.m.
potcat said...

I just read in this Papper "Alabama County files for largest municipal bankruptcy."

They were playing the Stock Market, JP Morgan, WAll Street, bonds.

A house of cards are beginning to fall. It begins Local and goes from there.

Unbelieavable that the U.S. Gov. has not stoped these Gambling Dens from Betting with these Cities money,and writting baloon payment bonds and increased interest rates hiden in them is Criminal.

Not one person on Wall Street has went to Jail nor has any thing changed.

Obama will be our next President, Wall Street will make sure of that!

November 10, 2011 at 6:03 p.m.
alprova said...

Harp3339 wrote: "I see nothing wrong with those not able to pay for their own abortion not being able to procreate since they are not likely able to support a child."

How in the hell can you begin to know that? An eighteen year old girl who finds herself pregnant, with her whole life ahead of her, can go on to become self-supporting, or she could marry a man who will take care of her. She can go on to many fine things, including motherhood, when the time is right.

Saddling herself with a child at that age complicates her life tremendously. Her chances of succeeding in life with a kid hanging off her hip are next to nothing. It's not impossible, but there has to be a certain amount of extended family support in place.

Not every unwed mother has that. And because of a mistake in giving in to the passions of a male partner and perhaps her own, you would penalize her for life by surgically making her barren?

Sheesh...

"Proliferation of a dependent society is not in the best interest of anyone."

And what do you think one of the major causes exists that contributes to a dependent society?

Unwed, poor mothers who have children far too soon in life.

November 10, 2011 at 7:01 p.m.
dude_abides said...

“I can’t — the third one. I can’t. Sorry. Oops.”

He didn't step in it, he did a total...slow motion...3D...FACE PLANT! I'm surprised they didn't feel it in Dalton!

At least Cain's supporters, the "Squirmin' Spermin' Herman Vermin" got a respite.

Even further off subject: All you 5 star football recruits better get in writing exactly what the Penn State Nittany Lions mean when they offer you a full ride. Should we refer to them now as Brokebacker U.?

November 10, 2011 at 7:17 p.m.
mymy said...

Pothead: Larry Langford known as La La Larry in Jefferson Co. AL SEC investigation and lawsuit In 2007, Langford and two associates were investigated by the Securities and Exchange Commission for actions which occurred during his tenure as County Commission president involving allegedly illegal transactions which steered County bond business to particular companies in exchange for bribes. On April 30, 2008, the Securities and Exchange Commission sued Langford in federal court. The lawsuit alleged Langford accepted more than $156,000 in cash and benefits from Montgomery banker Bill Blount in exchange for county bond business. Felony conviction and sentencing On the morning of December 1, 2008, Larry Langford was arrested by the FBI on a 101 count indictment alleging conspiracy, bribery, fraud, money laundering, and filing false tax returns in connection with a long-running bribery scheme. He was led into the courtroom in leg-irons Also indicted were lobbyist and former state Democratic Party executive director Al LaPierre, and Montgomery investment banker and bond underwriter, and former state Democratic Party chairman, William B. Blount of Parrish & Co. While Langford was head of the Jefferson County commission, he engaged in a variable rate auction and bond swaps to raise money to help improve the county's sewer system. Langford was convicted of receiving $235,000 in bribes from Blount, some routed through Al LaPierre, to help influence the bond deals. According to the indictment, William Blount helped Langford receive a $50,000 loan, which was used to purchase jewelry, including a Rolex watch, and designer clothes. Blount's firm earned $7.1 million in fees from the bond deals while LaPierre was paid $219,500 by Blount for his help the scheme. Jefferson County banks made approximately $120 million by encouraging the county to refinance nearly all of its bonds using swaps. The bonds resulted in a $3.2 billion sewer debt, contributing to the Jefferson County commissioners voting to declare bankruptcy on November 10, 2011 in what will be the largest municipal bankruptcy in U.S. history. The government is currently seeking $7.6 million in forfeiture from the three men. After being convicted in a trial in federal court in Tuscaloosa, Alabama, Langford is now serving a 15 year federal felony sentence. He is an inmate #27349-001 at FCI Ashland, a Federal prison in Ashland, Kentucky. His projected release date is listed as May 1, 2023. Go to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jefferso... and read:

Sewer construction and bond swap controversy

November 10, 2011 at 7:52 p.m.
fairmon said...

Alprova responds.......

Not every unwed mother has that. And because of a mistake in giving in to the passions of a male partner and perhaps her own, you would penalize her for life by surgically making her barren?

I would and her male partner as will if he is known, apparently you wouldn't. You are willing to pay for a lot of things I am not. It is easy to make choices when there are no consequences and you spend other peoples money for risky choices.

November 10, 2011 at 8:05 p.m.
potcat said...

mymy

looks like you have drank the Koolaide by the gallons you are so full oF PO, you might want to smoke one, it could clear the gutter clutter in that partisan brain of yours. SEC is a joke, and in Bama, he he ha ha, you got to be kidding.

What the hell are you talking about, its not that complicated. When someone goes off subject into a rant and starts blathering on and on and on, its VERY telling.

You are Wrong and not for the first time either.Just because they have some fall guys means nothing, Alabama is famous for it. You might want to read a little history about that.

Good God get a grip and some common sense.

Good night and shut the hell up.

November 10, 2011 at 9:29 p.m.
alprova said...

Harp3339 wrote: "I would and her male partner as will if he is known, apparently you wouldn't."

In my younger days, I had several spur of the moment encounters with women that I dated. I'm not proud of that fact, but it happened. Thankfully, to the best of my knowledge, I never impregnated any of them, but it could have happened.

After marriage, I went on to father three children.

My question to you, not that it is any of my business, is to ask if you have ever in your life, especially in your youth, had similar instances of passion, before you became this perfect person that you hold yourself up to be now?

"You are willing to pay for a lot of things I am not."

You are not paying for abortions. The chances that a penny of your taxes was used for such a purpose is next to nothing.

"It is easy to make choices when there are no consequences and you spend other peoples money for risky choices."

Nobody is perfect. Everyone makes bad choices during their lifetime. I'm sure that you have made some bad ones too.

You're being just a wee bit holier than thou on this one.

November 10, 2011 at 10:29 p.m.
fairmon said...

alprova responds with....

Nobody is perfect. Everyone makes bad choices during their lifetime. I'm sure that you have made some bad ones too..

I have made bad choices and suffered the consequences.

alprova responds....

You are not paying for abortions. The chances that a penny of your taxes was used for such a purpose is next to nothing.

Most government program amounts to only penny's for most tax payers. As you know it is no cost to 47% of them. I don't think any local, state or federal tax dollars should be spent paying for abortions. If you play you pay but if you want the government to pay then there should be a guarantee there will not be a repeat.

November 11, 2011 at 6:01 a.m.
fairmon said...

potcat...

Wall St. had nothing to do with the failure of the city in Alabama. The elected officials of many cities and states sell bonds to the public to raise money for a project which is how they get in debt. Chattanooga has a similar problem and recently had to roll over a bond debt at a high cost because they couldn't pay the debt due. People buy municipal bonds as in investment that pays them tax exempt interest. The bankruptcy means those people buying bonds, including banks if they bought them, will lose the money they invested.

In the Alabama case a local bank was used and bribed a city official to enable them to handle the bond issue at a higher than necessary interest rate. In this case they would have been better off to have used a Wall Street bank.

November 11, 2011 at 6:19 a.m.
davisss13 said...

The GOP is just using this red meat issue to inflame the idiot base. The posts here show exactly why. These so-called 'pro-life' advocates can act like animals, cheer shock and awe (which killed many innocent children, elderly and pregnant women), defend torturing SUSPECTS, global religious war and unfettered greed and still expect to be considered fine, upstanding men of faith. What a load.

Christian morals and values? WHERE? These idiots don't care about anything but getting elected so they can open the government cash spigot for themselves and shove their situational religion down our throats 24/7... all while advocating policies that are diametrically opposed to everything Jesus said..

You people are a disease, a sickness. Raging, amoral, dishonest militant Christians are disgusting.

November 11, 2011 at 7:12 a.m.
dougmusn said...

Righteous wrote:

The truth is, we should not waste the aborted baibes, they are a good source of stem cells and protein. There are too many people on the planet already. We should take all the unemployed women (voluntarily of course) and set up baby farms and use this precious resource to solve hunger/medical problems for the living. Just my opinion.

Take a moment and Google [Jonathan Swift A Modest Proposal]. Your opinion is actually an old one...

November 11, 2011 at 7:20 a.m.
sandyonsignal said...

The Right to Privacy is for men only in the pro-life world. Rep. Fleischmann was proud to support "Protect Life Except if You Are a Women Act" shows how little he values half of the population. Fleischmann won't be happy until women are wearing burkhas and are living the Handmaid's Tale.

Good cartoon, Clay.

Ofbill.

November 11, 2011 at 7:30 a.m.
davisss13 said...

Why didn't the 'upstanding men of god' in the GOP pass this crap when they had a lock on both houses of congress and the presidency?

Because it's nothing but political posturing and they were busy showering riches on the pharisees.

November 11, 2011 at 8:34 a.m.
mymy said...

Potcat said: When someone goes off subject into a rant and starts blathering on and on and on, its VERY telling.

It was you that brought the subject up in the first place and you are the one smoking "pot" perhaps. The left can never admit that they are wrong/corrupt.

I have a friend in AL and have heard about this mess for years.

Wall St. is left leaning. My guess is they get the best “crony capitalism” deals from DC, so they will throw big money to The Bomb!

Re the present subj: it is getting old with so many more important issues on the agenda at present. I'm in the middle re this subj. except for late/partial birth abortions and I stand firm with a NO. I think public assistants should be stopped after 1 "mistake, bad decision". It only encourages more lack of personal responsibility.

November 11, 2011 at 9:01 a.m.
Oz said...

davisss13... What about the raging, amoral, dishonest militant atheist? Are they disgusting too? Is it raging, amoral dishonest miltant people you have a problem with or just Chrisitans?

What about the showering of riches on the pharisees at Solyndra, Sunpower, Tesla, and Fiskar?

Both parties are equally disgusting, in regards to cronyism, in my opinion.

November 11, 2011 at 10:46 a.m.
lkeithlu said...

What about the raging, amoral, dishonest militant atheist?

Hey, I resemble that remark!

In all seriousness, do you know any?

November 11, 2011 at 11:33 a.m.
Oz said...

Stalin and Hitler come to mind.

November 11, 2011 at noon
limric said...

lkeithlu,

Leave off one word (atheist)and that perfectly describes the whole of the last Republican administration.

November 11, 2011 at 12:25 p.m.
blackwater48 said...

THERE ARE THREE THINGS WRONG WITH REPUBLICANS

First: they want to protect the millionaires and billionaires who don't pay taxes, ship our jobs overseas, and stash their cash in the Caymans.

Second: they want to keep the 99.8% of us who work for a living poor and dependent on big corporations.

Third: uh, there are three things wrong with republicans... protect the rich... abolish workers' rights... there are three things... um, sorry... oops.

November 11, 2011 at 1:12 p.m.
lkeithlu said...

Stalin and Hitler come to mind.

You actually know them? Share a beer every now and then?

November 11, 2011 at 1:38 p.m.
JustOneWoman said...

Oz, you need to do some homework. Hitler would fit right in with the christian reich. In fact, he acted as if he thought he was one of the chosen ones, just like some of the teabagger republicans and "the family" do today. He was brought up catholic, and made some statements, as well as policies very much like the right wing today.

Oz, I dare you to compare the 2, hitler and the right wing, and show us the differences.

While you are at it, compare the way the Koch brothers are steering the tea bagger republican party and our country, where they are from, who their father was, why they even care. If I have learned anything at all from this tea bagger republican party, including Rove, if they are accusing anyone of anything, you can bet money that they are covering up that same offense on their own side. The more offensive their actions are, the louder they will scream that someone else is doing it.

November 11, 2011 at 1:44 p.m.
Oz said...

lkeithlu... Funny. We did burn a few back in the old days.

November 11, 2011 at 1:46 p.m.
JustOneWoman said...

blackwater48, 3 They hate, fear, and want to control women.

November 11, 2011 at 1:47 p.m.
lkeithlu said...

My point, Oz, is that atheists are no different than anyone else and do not deserve to be stereotyped. Last I looked, I am nothing like Stalin or Hitler. I don't even have a mustache! And then there is the problem with the "God is with us" belt buckles worn by nazis. Guess if Hitler was an atheist, they must have had to hide them from the boss, right? And Stalin? Did he not attend seminary? Was it "atheist" seminary?

November 11, 2011 at 1:56 p.m.
Oz said...

lkeithlu...I was not stereotyping anyone. I gave an example. It was not a blanket statement for all atheist. I know some very good people that are atheist. Hitler was not a Christian. A belt buckle does not make anyone a Christian. Attending a seminary does not make anyone a Christian. Many atheist own bibles for the literature value. That does not make them Christians. Some people in churches own bibles, fish bumper stickers, etc., and they attend every time the doors are open but they are not Christians. They are playing church and do not have a relationship with Jesus Christ.

Christians are stereotyped more than anyone. Why are Christians expected to be perfect? That is the biggest lie and myth in the world. Christianity is based on imperfection. Perfect people would not need a Savior. Why would they? They are perfect people. I realized I'm not perfect, cannot be perfect, and will never be perfect in this life. God knew we could never be perfect. That is why he sent his Son to die on the cross for our sins. I accepted his death as forgiveness for my sins. Christianity is a relationship with Jesus Christ and it begins with his forgiveness.

Forget perfect Christians, they do not exist. No Christian can be held up as the perfect standard. Billy Graham once said his greatest struggle was with lust. Amen to that. I struggle with that one on a daily basis. OK... I'm a guy and struggle every minute of the day with that one.

If you have something in your life that works for you, I'm happy for you. Just don't expect Christians to be perfect. They will never be perfect and I don't recall God using any perfect people in the bible either. I'm sure many of you are smarter and wiser than I am. I'm not a scholar, I'm just a Road Scholar and the road has been tough at times. If you are aware of a verse of scripture in the bible that says, Christians are perfect. Please post it and I will re-evaluate my thinking.

November 11, 2011 at 4:13 p.m.
mrsmusic said...

YES! Clay finally got it right! Police SHOULD protect human life - ALL life, even preborn life. (Yes, I know that wasn't Clay's intent for the cartoon. I'm being sarcastic about him finally getting it right.)

November 11, 2011 at 4:27 p.m.
lkeithlu said...

Oz, I never once claimed anyone, including a Christian, had to be perfect. I just can't stand people using the term "atheist" as a pejorative. I never hold others to standards I am not myself willing to strive for. I do, however, detest being told that unless I am religious I cannot possibly be a) good, b) honest, c) patriotic, d) moral. I do not apply morals to my attitudes about abortion.

I do, however, apply morals to the crime (yes, crime) of having children that then are abused, neglected, unwanted, uncared for, unguided, uneducated. Abortion should be first before an unwanted pregnancy is carried to term. I value all breathing children WAY above unborn children. ANY woman who does not want to be pregnant is at risk of being a bad parent. And as another poster said: I will support the end of abortion when all children are fed, loved, housed, cared for, educated and guided by loving adults.

November 11, 2011 at 4:50 p.m.
rolando said...

A very small correction, lkeithlu. "...ANY woman who does not want to be pregnant is at risk of being a bad parent." Make that, "ANY woman who [does or] does not want..." and we are again in full agreement.

The same holds true for fathers. We all have the potential to be bad parents. Killing the unborn is about a bad as they can get.

Someone always wants the unborn...excluding the abortionists, of course. The mom's just don't want the inconvenience of responsibility for their actions.

Why is the father never consulted? The child is half his, after all. Perhaps that is where the problem lies...her body, her child -- not his. Except when child support comes up. Personally, I think if the father wants the baby aborted to save paying child support and she has it anyway, he should be absolved of any and all responsibility for the child. Her body, her child, her decision, right?

November 11, 2011 at 7:20 p.m.
rolando said...

By the way, here it is the 11th day of the 11th month and our resident cartoonist doesn't even have the courtesy of tipping a hat to our military members, the very ones who guarantee him the right to draw whatever stupid thing he wants on this rag.

I find that omission obscene in the worst meaning of the word. Typical of the TFP executive staff to allow it, too.

Here are a couple examples of decent editorial cartoonists' efforts on this day.

http://townhall.com/political-cartoons/2011/11/11/93549

http://www.seattlepi.com/comics-and-games/fun/Mallard_Fillmore/

Anyone have any others from the leftist media? Or are they all like Bennett and ignore our heroes in favor of the great unwashed 99%? Or some ignorant football coach...

November 11, 2011 at 7:30 p.m.
NGAdad said...

I say to all you fundamentalist or anti-abortion folks."He who is without sin, throw the first stone." That is what your supposed guide had to say on the subject. No one threw a stone, in the presence of He who knows the heart. He did not address the issue specifically, as He did most others. Why is that? He was, however, talking about a harlot - who if anyone may have had that in her past, who knows but Him. You know it alls would probably have reached down to grab a stone, only to find being turned yourselves into a block of salt.

November 12, 2011 at 10:18 a.m.
chet123 said...

IM BACK....CAN you beleive these republican nuts....control freaks...they are hard on blacks and females....i wander why they turn their head the other way with WALLSTREET....ha ha ha....they self anionted themselves as champion of life ha ha ha...the whole world saw these fools(so-call pro-lifer)during a republican debate yell out "LET HIM DIE" (because a man couldnt afford health insurance)THESE FOOLS FORGOT THEY WERE ON NATIONAL TV AND LET THEIR TRUE COLOR SHOW...THEY YELLED OUT "LET HIM DIE" HA HA HA HA THESE THE REPUBLICAN BOZOS THAT CLAIM TO BE GODLY AND PRO-LIFE..YELLED OUT "LET HIM DIE" .."LET HIM DIE" "LET HIM DIE",,,,PRAYING 24/7....PLACING TEN COMMANDMENT EVERYWHERE HA HA HA ...AND HAVE NO COMPASSION HA HA "LET HIM DIE" HOW WOULD THE SICK MAN'S CHILDREN FEEL ABOUT THEM SHOVING RELIGION DOWN THEIR THROAT WITH THAT KIND OF HATE AND ATTITUDE,SPIRIT....AND DISREGARD.....THEY ARE FULL BLOOM PHONY AND ANTI-LIFE...THE CLOWNS FORGOT THEY HAD A NATIONAL AUDIENCE HA HA HA......THERE IS AN EVILNESS ABOUT THEM...COLDNESS...UNGODLINESS! THESE COWARD HAVE NERVE TO HIDE BEHIND GOD AND PRAY.......HA HA!

November 13, 2011 at 7:21 a.m.

Amazing how much higher the percentage of men over women oppose choice. What does that tell us? mrnoocantnook

dat tellz uss dat da Menz hav wun haf uv a parrt en maykkin a baybee butt hav NO sayso wut kin happin ta dat baybee!

Also interesting: People who are pro-life are often pro-death penalty. People who are pro-choice are often anti-death penalty. Either way, they terminate life. mzegg-ellt-gee

Pruuf? Linx puhleez!

stoopid is az stoopid duz

&@##eevull raynes cuz peeples doo nuttin say nuttin an lett purvurts kill da baybees in da "Klinnix"**&&$$##@huck-eyenstiner

November 16, 2011 at 2:23 p.m.
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